From: Adrian on 10 Feb 2010 02:59
Ray Keattch <r.keattch5050(a)btinternet.com> gurgled happily, sounding much
like they were saying:
>> The A414/A1081 roundabout at the top of the d/c from M25 Jn22 (London
>> Colney) has long been a bad 'un for that - far, far worse than either
>> of the two you mentioned - especially at the ESE entrance, where 414
>> traffic heading west meets 1081 traffic heading onto the r'a'b. They
>> seem to have sorted it quite effectively, simply by painting the
>> continuation of the 414 lanes red. Far fewer people ignoring the
>> (always perfectly clear) markings and signage now. Again, too new for
>> any of the views.
> I have always been confused why so many drivers can't stay in lane going
> around that roundabout. As you say, the lane markings have always been
> clear, yet drivers insist on cutting corners.
> I was on the 414 heading SW once. I entered the roundabout in lane 2,
> passing the DC from the M25 on the left. The roundabout isn't circular
> at that point, so you appear to those (blind and stupid) drivers in lane
> one that you are entering their lane. Even though the lane markings
> clearly show that corner is more square than round, they just blindly
> cut straight across lane one.
Then there's the entertainment as three lanes (sometimes even four) try
to head down the 414. Despite the signage clearly pointing out that L1
heads into L1, L2 into L2, L3 & 4 round the r'a'b, the usual pattern is
that L2 heads into L1, L3 (sometimes L4) into L2, and gawd help the poor
sod who's actually following the markings in L1.
From: Harry Bloomfield on 10 Feb 2010 12:10
DavidR explained on 08/02/2010 :
> Other than with an unfeasable sidestep, the fourth couldn't possibly reach L1
> until after the exit. Just draw a straight line from it to the L1 apex.
I did and there is plenty of room for #4 to get over into L1 before his
> Staying in lane is usually regarded as good lane discipline.
Occupying any other lane than L1 without good reason is poor lane
> If you entered
> from the south in L2, where would you make your lane change? (Bearing in mind
> that the curves would turn it into a lane meander.)
Personally I would have moved over just before the entry before my
exit. It reinforces my intention to exit and the closer to the waiting
to enter cars I am, the less time I spend obstructing their entry.
> What is L2 for if not to be used?
To be used when necessary only.
Harry (M1BYT) (L)
From: DavidR on 10 Feb 2010 18:09
"Harry Bloomfield" <harry.m1byt(a)NOSPAM.tiscali.co.uk> wrote
> DavidR explained on 08/02/2010 :
>> Other than with an unfeasable sidestep, the fourth couldn't possibly
>> reach L1 until after the exit. Just draw a straight line from it to the
>> L1 apex.
> I did and there is plenty of room for #4 to get over into L1 before his
> assumed exit.
You have a really strange ruler.
>> Staying in lane is usually regarded as good lane discipline.
> Occupying any other lane than L1 without good reason is poor lane
In other words, all 4 cars should have circulated throughout in L1. The
fault occurred before entry.
>> If you entered from the south in L2, where would you make your lane
>> change? (Bearing in mind that the curves would turn it into a lane
> Personally I would have moved over just before the entry before my exit.
> It reinforces my intention to exit
You haven't answered my question about where a conflict could occur.
> and the closer to the waiting to enter cars I am, the less time I spend
> obstructing their entry.
That's nonsense. It is worse even than circulting in L1 because a lane
often causes a waiting driver to make a false start or to late brake after
initially assuming it is possible to keep rolling.
From: Nick Finnigan on 11 Feb 2010 12:38
> Oh, to you and Harry in particular, notice that there are 4 vehicles exiting
> east which are not following the Highway Code's (daft) suggestion to spiral
They are following Highway Code rule 186 to:
keep to the right on the roundabout until you need to change lanes to exit
even though it would be quicker and shorter to move change lane just as
they exit. Where does the HC say to spiral out?
From: Harry Bloomfield on 11 Feb 2010 12:51
DavidR expressed precisely :
> In other words, all 4 cars should have circulated throughout in L1.
I did not say that!
Unless there is good reason not to, the lead car in that picture should
have moved over to L1 - there was no reason for him/her not to. Using
L1 when going 3/4 way round would be wrong, but we don't know where
these cars actually entered the roundabout from. Holding onto L2,
without a good reason to do so, is a constant source of frustration on
> The fault
> occurred before entry.
Harry (M1BYT) (L)