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From: AstraVanMann on 9 Jul 2010 00:18
"Conor" <conor(a)gmx.co.uk> wrote:
>> Indeed, and the economy of most modern diesels versus the lack of
>> driveability and the utter shite powerbands *really* makes me wonder what
>> the point is.
>>
> That's because you buy Vauxhalls.

Really? I can't remember the last time I bought a Vauxhall.

> Ford TDCi is a completely different beast. I can leave it in 4th gear at
> 40MPH, shove my foot to the floor and out accelerate a BMW 328i from 40-70
> and not even have to change gear.

Apart from if the 328i was in 3rd, in which case it'd leave your Mondeo for
dead, and probably carry on until about 90 in that gear (at a guess).

What year is your Mondeo anyway? Probably just old enough that it's not
quite as strangled as some of the very latest ones. My Transit (140PS 2007
model) requires such a fine art of being in the extremely limited powerband
that it's definitely put me off buying one. Don't know how much better the
lower power ones are (like the 100PS models), but the old 90PS 2.4TDDI ones
felt *shitloads* quicker between 0 and 30. Sure, it goes well if you're
accelerating from 20 to 50-ish, but it's still a real precision thing to
keep it in the powerband. If I was buying something new I'd see what the
Sprinter ones are like and buy one with an auto, as they seem to be the only
ones that do proper auto boxes.

--
"For want of the price of tea and a slice, the old man died."


From: JC on 9 Jul 2010 04:44
On Thu, 8 Jul 2010 21:53:10 +0100, "AstraVanMann"
<peter(a)swerveweb.com> wrote:

>Indeed, and the economy of most modern diesels versus the lack of
>driveability and the utter shite powerbands *really* makes me wonder what
>the point is.

I find diesels more economical than petrol and more drivable. Power
"low down" is where you want it unless you want to drive like a boy
racer.
--
JC


From: Albert T Cone on 9 Jul 2010 06:20
AstraVanMann wrote:
>> Ford TDCi is a completely different beast. I can leave it in 4th gear at
>> 40MPH, shove my foot to the floor and out accelerate a BMW 328i from 40-70
>> and not even have to change gear.
>
> Apart from if the 328i was in 3rd, in which case it'd leave your Mondeo for
> dead, and probably carry on until about 90 in that gear (at a guess).
The 328 *is* quicker, but only if you use the gearbox. The 328 only
produces more power than the 130TDCi from 4000rpm up, and it peaks at
just over 5krpm. To get the best out of the 328 over 40-70, you need to
start in 2nd, changing up to 3rd at just below 60mph. In the TDCi,
with it's less linear and flatter power curve, it makes very little
difference whether you start in 3rd and change up, or just leave it in 4th.

> What year is your Mondeo anyway? Probably just old enough that it's not
> quite as strangled as some of the very latest ones. My Transit (140PS 2007
> model) requires such a fine art of being in the extremely limited powerband
> that it's definitely put me off buying one. Don't know how much better the
> lower power ones are (like the 100PS models), but the old 90PS 2.4TDDI ones
> felt *shitloads* quicker between 0 and 30. Sure, it goes well if you're
> accelerating from 20 to 50-ish, but it's still a real precision thing to
> keep it in the powerband.

yeah, but if you compare the torque graphs, the commercial diesels have
much more restricted rev range and are a lot less flexible, in the name
of better durability.

A decent petrol is always going to be more flexible than a diesel, and
more pleasant for general driving. To get the maximum performance out
of a petrol requires you to row the gearbox *more* than an equivalent
diesel - which is better depends largely on driving style.
From: AstraVanMann on 9 Jul 2010 10:41
"JC" <invalid(a)invalid.com> wrote:
>>Indeed, and the economy of most modern diesels versus the lack of
>>driveability and the utter shite powerbands *really* makes me wonder what
>>the point is.
>
> I find diesels more economical than petrol and more drivable. Power
> "low down" is where you want it unless you want to drive like a boy
> racer.

Could that statement be any more vague and generalised? Go on, try!

--
"For want of the price of tea and a slice, the old man died."


From: Mike P on 9 Jul 2010 11:51
JC wrote:
> On Thu, 8 Jul 2010 21:53:10 +0100, "AstraVanMann"
> <peter(a)swerveweb.com> wrote:
>
>> Indeed, and the economy of most modern diesels versus the lack of
>> driveability and the utter shite powerbands *really* makes me wonder
>> what the point is.
>
> I find diesels more economical than petrol and more drivable. Power
> "low down" is where you want it unless you want to drive like a boy
> racer.

My car is petrol, it has a turbo. It has loads of torque low down. You can,
if you wish, drive it like a diesel. You can also go like an utter loon and
out corner almost anything on the road.. even a Honda NSX ...

--
Mike P


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