Mini 8 port CAST IRON head
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From: Noddy on 1 Oct 2009 06:43 "John McKenzie" <jmac_melbourne(a)bigpond.com> wrote in message news:4AC483B8.535C(a)bigpond.com... > That pretty much sums them up. About my only 'gripe' about minis (not > that it matters now that I am 37, but it 'did' at one time, is you > categorically can't 'root' in them. Then again, I am a touch larger than > most mini owners. Yeah, I'd imagine you'd fins that an awkward task :) I parked the pork sword a couple of times in one of mine, but even for someone of my size it was pretty difficult. Basically a "sit on" with both the front seats tilted forward was the only way it would work. > I currently don't own a mini, but I have all the motors/boxes/go fast > bits - so if I ever grabbed myself a std mini with an ok body, it'd just > be a matter of a week or two and it'd be little ripper. I do miss > driving one, but I don't miss the regularity with which I'd break > gearbox/driveline bits. If you've ever interested in off-loading any of those bits I'd be interested as I may have one last go at a Mini one day. > Currently the 1200 coupe I have is sensational. It's not nearly as fast > in a straight line as I want it, but I warrant it handles as well as any > 1200 on street tyres. Interesting that they seem to work best if you > don't go too hard on the springs, and don't go too low. Next time you're over my way feel free to call in. I'd like to see it. -- Regards, Noddy.
From: Noddy on 1 Oct 2009 07:18 "hippo" <am9obmhAc2hvYWwubmV0LmF1(a)REGISTERED_USER_usenet.com.au> wrote in message news:ha20ac$ust$1(a)news.eternal-september.org... > BMC at least experimented with an earlier cast iron x flow head. They > dropped it in favour of the Arden head. Depending who or what you read, it > was the Westlake one, or a modified version of it, or maybe something that > they cobbled up themselves! There may or may not also have been a 7 port > version. I don't know, but it seems highly possible that some of the > histories may be relating fuzzy recollections as fact in some areas. Absolutely. It's certainly a very difficult subject to quantify with any accuracy that's for sure. The one thing I do know with any degree of certainty is that the only crossflow head that appeared in the Special Tuning catalogs between 1967 and 1972 was in fact the Arden head, and that's basically the point that Oz seems to have a problem with. > The cast iron x flow head only ever appears to have been available in very > limited quantities and doesn't *appear* to have been publicly available. > Mind you, I've seen much larger things than a cylinder head go through a > fuly manned security gate in my time.... Having said that, there is a > South African forum where someone was about to sell a 'cast iron, cross > flow, MoWoG head', of which there were apparently only four in the > country. But they could all be Westlake, or something else by somebody > else. The head Oz linked to that was submitted for homologation approval was certainly a Weslake casting, and while I've got some interesting old factory publications amongst my stuff I can't find any reference to anything that was uniquely BMC as far as crossflow head castings go. Of course, that certainly doesn't mean they didn't or couldn't have existed, but given that both the Arden and Weslake heads were outstanding performers and arrived on the scene at around the same time as the first "big block" Coopers started to emerge ( and prior for the Weslake) it's hard to imagine the "factory" bothering with other designs when they must have known that either of the after-market heads would be pushing the engines to near their physical limits. If BMC actually did bother to experiment with a crossflow head of their own design I wouldn't be the slightest bit surprised, as not everything they did made sense, but the fact that very little (if anything) can be found to support such a theory suggest that if they did it was anything but successful. > We (surely) all know by now, there are various manifold, carb and head > listings in various publications which have varying degrees of credibility > / accuracy / historical provenance. Indeed. > I hope this contributes to the sensible side of the debate, but it's > probably the closest I'll get to actuality unless someone out there is > Hopkirk, Aaltonen, Tubman, or somesuch, in disguise! I'm guising Oz is at least two of those, with David Vizard thrown in for good measure :) > If the thread's still going in December, I'll see if I can find out > anything while I'm over there; but don't hold your breath! Cheers Even if it's not I'd be interested to hear what you may learn. My best guess is that the Arden head is, in fact, the commonly referred to "Mowog crossflow", and that a BMC designed/manufactured cast iron crossflow head either never got past the experimental stage or never existed at all. I base that on a couple of key points: The first being that Weslake had been making heads for *years* before the works Mini teams existed and BMC works Mini's were fitted with Weslake heads back in the days of the 970 and 10701 S, and with that in mind it's somewhat difficult to fathom why BMC would bother with a crossflow head of their own design/construction given that the Weslake head worked pretty well and the number of their own heads they'd realistically expect to sell would be so low as to not justify the tooling outlay. The second point being that the early versions of the Arden head had "Mowog" cast into them, and that was most likely a concession Jim Whitehouse was willing to make in exchange for the heads to be made available thought BMC's special tuning department. Weslake, being a company of considerably higher stature than Arden Engineering, was probably in a good enough position to not need to give concessions to help their business. It's just a theory, and I have nothing concrete to support it, but it's one that seems the most logical to me. Of course, I'm happy to stand corrected, and if you should happen to find anything relating to a BMC designed/manufactured crossflow head I'd genuinely be very interested to see or hear about it. -- Regards, Noddy.
From: John_H on 1 Oct 2009 23:46 John McKenzie wrote: >John_H wrote: >> Noddy wrote: >> >"John_H" <john4721(a)inbox.com> wrote in message >> >news:ou86c5dks0ji3vdfasdmd1t6q38u85491f(a)4ax.com... >> > >> >> Which tells you what about the camshaft? >> > >> >That he was the only person on earth who used a conventional camshaft and >> >got it to work with an 8 port valve sequence. >> >> You can forget about the Webers then... his rocker gear would've been >> the really clever bit! :) > >On top of that, they would have been desmodromic to boot - no doubt he >invented that too. If he could make it work on an 8 port cross flow head, with a cam gound for a conventional 5 port head it would certainly be a world first... especially since desmos require an extra set of lobes. :) I'm prepared to give him full marks merely for making all the valves on the 8 port open in the correct sequence. Lemme see.... that's EI EI EI EI vs EI IE EI IE (if memory serves me correct) but it gets way too complicated after that! No doubt google will have an answer lurking somewhere. ;-) -- John H
From: hippo on 2 Oct 2009 00:40 John_H wrote: > > John McKenzie wrote: > >John_H wrote: > >> Noddy wrote: > >> >"John_H" <john4721(a)inbox.com> wrote in message > >> >news:ou86c5dks0ji3vdfasdmd1t6q38u85491f(a)4ax.com... > >> > > >> >> Which tells you what about the camshaft? > >> > > >> >That he was the only person on earth who used a conventional camshaft and > >> >got it to work with an 8 port valve sequence. > >> > >> You can forget about the Webers then... his rocker gear would've been > >> the really clever bit! :) > > > >On top of that, they would have been desmodromic to boot - no doubt he > >invented that too. > > If he could make it work on an 8 port cross flow head, with a cam > gound for a conventional 5 port head it would certainly be a world > first... especially since desmos require an extra set of lobes. :) > > I'm prepared to give him full marks merely for making all the valves > on the 8 port open in the correct sequence. Lemme see.... that's > EI EI EI EI vs EI IE EI IE (if memory serves me correct) but it gets > way too complicated after that! > > No doubt google will have an answer lurking somewhere. ;-) > Forty Two? -- Posted at www.usenet.com.au
From: Brad on 2 Oct 2009 00:58
"hippo" <am9obmhAc2hvYWwubmV0LmF1(a)REGISTERED_USER_usenet.com.au> wrote in message news:ha408m$u51$1(a)news.eternal-september.org... | John_H wrote: | > | > John McKenzie wrote: | > >John_H wrote: | > >> Noddy wrote: | > >> >"John_H" <john4721(a)inbox.com> wrote in message | > >> >news:ou86c5dks0ji3vdfasdmd1t6q38u85491f(a)4ax.com... | > >> > | > >> >> Which tells you what about the camshaft? | > >> > | > >> >That he was the only person on earth who used a conventional camshaft and | > >> >got it to work with an 8 port valve sequence. | > >> | > >> You can forget about the Webers then... his rocker gear would've been | > >> the really clever bit! :) | > > | > >On top of that, they would have been desmodromic to boot - no doubt he | > >invented that too. | > | > If he could make it work on an 8 port cross flow head, with a cam | > gound for a conventional 5 port head it would certainly be a world | > first... especially since desmos require an extra set of lobes. :) | > | > I'm prepared to give him full marks merely for making all the valves | > on the 8 port open in the correct sequence. Lemme see.... that's | > EI EI EI EI vs EI IE EI IE (if memory serves me correct) but it gets | > way too complicated after that! | > | > No doubt google will have an answer lurking somewhere. ;-) | > | | Forty Two? | | -- | Posted at www.usenet.com.au The answer to "Life the Universe and Everything" has always been easier to sort out than a noddy -Ozwarped poop fight. -- Brad Leyden 6� 43.5816' S 146� 59.3097' E WGS84 To mail spam is really hot but please reply to thread so all may benefit (or laugh at my mistakes) > > |