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From: Mr. Benn on 2 Aug 2010 08:29
"GT" <a(a)b.c> wrote in message
news:4c56a1da$0$15733$c3e8da3(a)news.astraweb.com...
> I was stopped at a strange 3-way junction yesterday, which I have driven
> through several times in the last few years, but certainly not regularly.
> I was waiting to turn right, in the right lane. Its one of those double
> traffic lights, where you have 2 red-amber-green lights next to each
> other. The green light was on for straight on and the red light was on for
> turning right. I sat there for ages while the cars streamed past me on the
> left, going straight on. Eventually I got a green right turn filter while
> the straight on cars were still green. Off I went. No problem....
>
> We did the shopping, had an ice cream, then a drive around. We then ended
> up at the same set of lights again on our way home. This time I was in the
> straight on lane which was at green and the right turn light was red, but
> no cars waiting. As I approached the lights I saw amber and remembered how
> long I had sat there last time before the right turn went amber then
> green, so I ignored it as I was going straight on this time. As I went
> through the lights I spotted them both turn red and couldn't understand
> why my light was suddenly red, but it was too late to do anything about
> it. What had actually happened was that the turn right never moved from
> red, but the amber that I saw was my straight on green coming to an end. I
> didn't pay enough attention to the lights and ended up going through red
> (just).
>
> This was a simple mistake, but cause by a combination of 3 things:
> 1. The lights sequence wasn't the same sequence as 30 minutes previous
> 2. The 2 sets of lights are right next to each other - one 'unit'.
> 3. I presumed the sequence was the same (1) and therefore didn't pay
> enough attention.

Good for you for admitting your mistake. We all make them from time to
time.

From: Mortimer on 2 Aug 2010 10:30
"GT" <a(a)b.c> wrote in message
news:4c56a1da$0$15733$c3e8da3(a)news.astraweb.com...

> This was a simple mistake, but cause by a combination of 3 things:
> 1. The lights sequence wasn't the same sequence as 30 minutes previous
> 2. The 2 sets of lights are right next to each other - one 'unit'.
> 3. I presumed the sequence was the same (1) and therefore didn't pay
> enough attention.

Having two sets of lights next to each other can be very confusing. I
normally make the opposite mistake: stopping at a red light, only to realise
that it doesn't apply to the direction that I want to go but only to a
left/right turn.

I wonder why it is only the green light of a filter which is an arrow. It
would be useful if the corresponding red and amber lights were also arrows
for a filter, then you could distinguish straight-on lights from filter
lights more easily when they are are adjacent heads on the same pole.

There is a set of lights near me for a junction that was remodelled (and
dramatically improved) a few years ago. As you approach from one direction,
you see red lights from about 1/4 mile away and think that you'll need to
stop, only to see as you get much closer that these lights are for a right
turn and than the straight-on green light has been hidden by a large bush
until you get close. A red arrow (and cutting back of the bush) would help a
lot.

From: Harry Bloomfield on 3 Aug 2010 15:10
Mortimer laid this down on his screen :
> "GT" <a(a)b.c> wrote in message
> news:4c56a1da$0$15733$c3e8da3(a)news.astraweb.com...
>
>> This was a simple mistake, but cause by a combination of 3 things:
>> 1. The lights sequence wasn't the same sequence as 30 minutes previous
>> 2. The 2 sets of lights are right next to each other - one 'unit'.
>> 3. I presumed the sequence was the same (1) and therefore didn't pay
>> enough attention.
>
> Having two sets of lights next to each other can be very confusing. I
> normally make the opposite mistake: stopping at a red light, only to realise
> that it doesn't apply to the direction that I want to go but only to a
> left/right turn.
>
> I wonder why it is only the green light of a filter which is an arrow. It
> would be useful if the corresponding red and amber lights were also arrows
> for a filter, then you could distinguish straight-on lights from filter
> lights more easily when they are are adjacent heads on the same pole.
>
> There is a set of lights near me for a junction that was remodelled (and
> dramatically improved) a few years ago. As you approach from one direction,
> you see red lights from about 1/4 mile away and think that you'll need to
> stop, only to see as you get much closer that these lights are for a right
> turn and than the straight-on green light has been hidden by a large bush
> until you get close. A red arrow (and cutting back of the bush) would help a
> lot.

Speaking of filters, I was on the relatively narrow climb out of Whitby
today, following a female driver, when we got to the top there is a
wide road to the right, at a traffic light controlled junction and an
especially long 10m right turn lane beyond the stop line for those
wanting to turn right. The lights turn green for all, we all move
forward, then we stop due to the opposing flow. Once the lights turn
back to red, she sits there and doesn't move, but needed to be
prompted.

Obviously didn't understand that once you had crossed the stop line, it
was perfectly legal to complete the maneuver even if the lights have
changed back to red. In mitigation for her, there is a filter light,
but I suspect it only works when the road is especially busy with
holiday traffic.

--
Regards,
Harry (M1BYT) (L)
http://www.ukradioamateur.co.uk


From: Mike Barnes on 3 Aug 2010 18:51
Harry Bloomfield <harry.m1byt(a)NOSPAM.tiscali.co.uk>:
>Obviously didn't understand that once you had crossed the stop line, it
>was perfectly legal to complete the maneuver even if the lights have
>changed back to red.

Here's another scenario. I cross the line on green but I'm prevented
from turning right by oncoming traffic. When the lights turn to red,
there's no opportunity for me to turn right before the cross traffic
starts flowing. Then the cross traffic dries up with the lights in front
of me still on red.

Do I complete the right turn before the lights turn back to green?

My reading of the situation is that there's no legal reason why I
shouldn't. But something stops me.

--
Mike Barnes
From: Mike P on 4 Aug 2010 04:18
GT wrote:

> 3. I presumed the sequence was the same and therefore didn't pay
> enough attention.

I did this in Greece about 18 years ago, on a motorbike. I hit a Nissan
Micra that was turning left across my side of the carriageway, went over the
bonnet and landed 50yds down the road in a bus shelter. Cost me 8 weeks in
plaster and a pin in my leg..

--
Mike P



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