Paul Smith
in [UK Drivers]
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From: Brimstone on 19 Dec 2007 07:03 Dave Larrington wrote: > In news:5YSdnZkXE_xGsPXanZ2dnUVZ8sGvnZ2d(a)bt.com, > Brimstone <brimstone520-ng01(a)yahoo.co.uk> tweaked the Babbage-Engine > to tell us: > >> As would not "driving Minis as fast I could around roundabouts" thus >> giving the other drivers time to see you. > > In most of the Minis I've driven, that's about 7 mph Then you haven't driven many Minis.
From: Brimstone on 19 Dec 2007 07:03 Peter Clinch wrote: > Adrian wrote: > [bike bell] >> It's still a legal requirement. > > To be fitted at sale, not to be fitted in use. > Oh dear.
From: Brimstone on 19 Dec 2007 07:04 MrBitsy wrote: > Clive George wrote: >> "MrBitsy" <ray(a)nowhere.com> wrote in message >> news:OWZ9j.10620$h35.4554(a)newsfe2-gui.ntli.net... >>> Clive George wrote: >>>> "MrBitsy" <ray(a)nowhere.com> wrote in message >>>> news:deZ9j.12144$ov2.11527(a)newsfe5-win.ntli.net... >>>>> DavidR wrote: >>>>>> "MrBitsy" <ray(a)nowhere.com> wrote >>>>>>> DavidR wrote: >>>>>>>> "MrBitsy" <ray(a)nowhere.com> wrote >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Many cyclists, like pedestrians, seem oblivious in very simple >>>>>>>>> ways to keep themselves safe - not obeying red lights for >>>>>>>>> instance. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Is this dangerous? Are there any figures to bear it out? >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Are you seriously suggestion it is safe to pass red traffic >>>>>>> lights under normal conditions? >>>>>> >>>>>> The question makes no such suggestion. I am asking you - is it >>>>>> dangerous? And please give reasons. Then I will offer my opinion. >>>>> >>>>> You don't know why it would be dangerous to not obey red traffic >>>>> lights? >>>> >>>> I can think of cases where it would be safe to not obey red traffic >>>> lights. If you can't, then you're pretty dim. >>> >>> Are we talking everyday normal use of traffic controlled junctions? >> >> Define that a bit better :-) The strict answer is "it depends". >> >> (coz I'm not Brimstone, I'll not stop there.) >> >> Red traffic lights don't just happen at traffic controlled junctions >> - road works and road crossings are the two other ones I can think >> of. So that's one reason why your question isn't helpful. But here's >> the main one: >> Safety when not obeying them isn't an absolute - just as you say safe >> speed isn't the absolute prescribed figure. It depends on the >> circumstances - what other vehicles/people are present, how much can >> you see, how fast are they going. You're very keen on observing the >> hazards and making an appropriate decision when it comes to speed >> limits - why not apply this to other laws too? After all, it's easy >> to provide cases where it is perfectly safe to ignore a red traffic >> light - and indeed, it's even easy to provide them where it's not >> only safe, but doesn't even slightly affect other road users. >> And that applies no matter what your mode of transport. Of course, >> the fact that it's rather easier when you're small, manoeverable and >> have better opportunities for observation could be a reason for >> considering some modes rather more than others (and indeed the law >> recognises this to an extent). > > When choosing a speed to travel at, all hazzards, road & weather > conditions are taken into account. I am always going to be travelling > on the correct side of the road, in a direction other road users and > pedestrians expect me to be going. A 10% difference in speed is not > going to catch someone out, if the driver has chosen that speed on an > accurate assesment of those conditions. > > A red traffic light is an absolute message to stop. I know this and > all other road users are expecting me to comply with it. Other road > users will be approaching green traffic lights expecting the road to > be clear. Many motorists will not be observing either side of the > junction for road users not obeying the red. Therefore, not obeying a > red traffic signal, has far more risks associated with it than going > a little faster than a posted speed limit - one that has no idea of > the conditions when I pass it. What if there are no other road users?
From: Rob Morley on 19 Dec 2007 07:10 In article <5YSdnZkXE_xGsPXanZ2dnUVZ8sGvnZ2d(a)bt.com>, Brimstone brimstone520-ng01(a)yahoo.co.uk says... > As would not "driving Minis as fast I could around roundabouts" Where's the fun in that? I was driving at legal speeds, had right of way, road conditions and visibility good ...
From: Rob Morley on 19 Dec 2007 07:12
In article <lfqdnXa6PIQClfTanZ2dnUVZ8q6onZ2d(a)bt.com>, Brimstone brimstone520-ng01(a)yahoo.co.uk says... > Peter Clinch wrote: > > Adrian wrote: > > [bike bell] > >> It's still a legal requirement. > > > > To be fitted at sale, not to be fitted in use. > > > Oh dear. > Why? |