Query on seatbelts
in [Aussie Drivers]
|
From: D Walford on 11 Jun 2010 20:15 On 12/06/2010 9:56 AM, Doug Jewell wrote: >>>> Perfectly safe if worn properly. >>>> Operator error causes most injuries. >>> That's why racing cars all have lap-sash seat belts the same as fitted >>> to passenger vehicles. >> >> A racing harness may be better at restraining people in vehicles but >> they aren't very practical and in some circumstances could be >> considered dangerous in a road car. >> Mate used to have them in his road registered Clubman but took them >> out because you were strapped in so tight you couldn't move enough to >> allow you to see the traffic in certain circumstances. > You're 100% right of course, but if lap-sash belts were "perfectly safe" > as ozone claimed, they'd be good enough for race cars as well. > I think the OP's point is a valid one though. The basic design of the > seatbelt hasn't changed in 40'odd years. About the only change has been > the auto-tensioner/retractor, which is a vast improvement over the old > belts, which were either too tight, so as to restrict movement, or too > loose and hence with lower effectiveness. > I wonder if an auto-tensioning/retracting multi-point harness would be > feasible? Could potentially be done in such a way that you have freedom > of movement, but in the event of a crash it locks up and spreads the > force over a greater area of the body. Retracting harness's already exist but because of low volumes they are very expensive. Current seatbelts are good enough in most circumstances, they aren't perfect but they are a good compromise between safety and practicality. If seatbelts are more difficult to wear then its very likely less people will wear them. Its true that people can get injuries from their seatbelts but they usually live to talk about it, without a seatbelt the result will be very different. It may be possible to increase the width of seatbelts by a small amount but I'd be amazed if that hadn't already been tested by the belt manufacturers and safety regulators, if tests had found that a wider belt worked better I'd bet we would already have them. Daryl
From: Clocky on 11 Jun 2010 21:29 Doug Jewell wrote: > D Walford wrote: >> On 12/06/2010 7:56 AM, Doug Jewell wrote: >>> OzOne(a)Crackerbox-Palace.com wrote: >>>> On Fri, 11 Jun 2010 21:15:22 +1000, "Milton" <millame23(a)yahoo.com> >>>> wrote: >>>> >>>>> It's incredible the amount of serious injuries caused to persons >>>>> in an accident (especially head-ons) from wearing seatbelts. >>>>> Whilst I agree it's safer to still wear them than not, I believe >>>>> it would be safer if seatbelts were at least another inch wider. >>>>> The amount of pressure on the body points would be reduced >>>>> substantially. There have been cases where the belt has actually >>>>> cut people to the point that their stomach intestines have come >>>>> through the cut. I just don't believe the current belts are wide >>>>> enough to give >>>>> safer protection to the body. >>>>> >>>>> Cheers >>>>> >>>>> Milton >>>> >>>> Perfectly safe if worn properly. >>>> Operator error causes most injuries. >>> That's why racing cars all have lap-sash seat belts the same as >>> fitted to passenger vehicles. >> >> A racing harness may be better at restraining people in vehicles but >> they aren't very practical and in some circumstances could be >> considered dangerous in a road car. >> Mate used to have them in his road registered Clubman but took them >> out because you were strapped in so tight you couldn't move enough >> to allow you to see the traffic in certain circumstances. > You're 100% right of course, but if lap-sash belts were > "perfectly safe" as ozone claimed, they'd be good enough for > race cars as well. > I think the OP's point is a valid one though. The basic > design of the seatbelt hasn't changed in 40'odd years. About > the only change has been the auto-tensioner/retractor, which > is a vast improvement over the old belts, which were either > too tight, so as to restrict movement, or too loose and > hence with lower effectiveness. Enter pyrotechnic pretensioners...
From: Clocky on 11 Jun 2010 21:31 D Walford wrote: > On 12/06/2010 9:56 AM, Doug Jewell wrote: > >>>>> Perfectly safe if worn properly. >>>>> Operator error causes most injuries. >>>> That's why racing cars all have lap-sash seat belts the same as >>>> fitted to passenger vehicles. >>> >>> A racing harness may be better at restraining people in vehicles but >>> they aren't very practical and in some circumstances could be >>> considered dangerous in a road car. >>> Mate used to have them in his road registered Clubman but took them >>> out because you were strapped in so tight you couldn't move enough >>> to allow you to see the traffic in certain circumstances. >> You're 100% right of course, but if lap-sash belts were "perfectly >> safe" as ozone claimed, they'd be good enough for race cars as well. >> I think the OP's point is a valid one though. The basic design of the >> seatbelt hasn't changed in 40'odd years. About the only change has >> been the auto-tensioner/retractor, which is a vast improvement over >> the old belts, which were either too tight, so as to restrict >> movement, or too loose and hence with lower effectiveness. >> I wonder if an auto-tensioning/retracting multi-point harness would >> be feasible? Could potentially be done in such a way that you have >> freedom of movement, but in the event of a crash it locks up and >> spreads the force over a greater area of the body. > > Retracting harness's already exist but because of low volumes they are > very expensive. > Current seatbelts are good enough in most circumstances, they aren't > perfect but they are a good compromise between safety and > practicality. If seatbelts are more difficult to wear then its very > likely less people will wear them. > Its true that people can get injuries from their seatbelts but they > usually live to talk about it, without a seatbelt the result will be > very different. > It may be possible to increase the width of seatbelts by a small > amount but I'd be amazed if that hadn't already been tested by the > belt manufacturers and safety regulators, if tests had found that a > wider belt worked better I'd bet we would already have them. > They probably found that a wider belt may reduce injury under certain circumstances whilst increasing the risk of injury in others.
From: Scotty on 12 Jun 2010 03:04 "Athol" <athol_SPIT_SPAM(a)idl.net.au> wrote in message news:1276313336.662095(a)idlwebserver.idl.com.au... : Diesel Damo <Diesel_4WD(a)yahoo.com.au> wrote: : > On Jun 11, 9:15� pm, "Milton" <millam...(a)yahoo.com> wrote: : : >> It's incredible the amount of serious injuries caused to persons in an : >> accident (especially head-ons) from wearing seatbelts. Whilst I agree it's : >> safer to still wear them than not, I believe it would be safer if seatbelts : >> were at least another inch wider. The amount of pressure on the body points : >> would be reduced substantially. : : Absolutely completely and utterly wrong. The function of seatbelts is to : bear load against the bones of the skeleton in order to minimise soft tissue : injuries. If you made the belts wider, the loads would be applied in places : that would increase injury, such as cutting into the side of the neck, or : coming up over the top of the hip bones and having the top edge of the belt : cut into the intestines. : While I see sence in your explanation I cant help wonder why Racing harnesses are three to four inches wide!?!?!? : Athol : <http://cust.idl.com.au/athol> Linux Registered User # 254000 : I'm a Libran Engineer. I don't argue, I discuss.
From: D Walford on 12 Jun 2010 04:06
On 12/06/2010 5:04 PM, Scotty wrote: > "Athol"<athol_SPIT_SPAM(a)idl.net.au> wrote in message > news:1276313336.662095(a)idlwebserver.idl.com.au... > : Diesel Damo<Diesel_4WD(a)yahoo.com.au> wrote: > :> On Jun 11, 9:15� pm, "Milton"<millam...(a)yahoo.com> wrote: > : > :>> It's incredible the amount of serious injuries caused to persons in an > :>> accident (especially head-ons) from wearing seatbelts. Whilst I agree it's > :>> safer to still wear them than not, I believe it would be safer if seatbelts > :>> were at least another inch wider. The amount of pressure on the body points > :>> would be reduced substantially. > : > : Absolutely completely and utterly wrong. The function of seatbelts is to > : bear load against the bones of the skeleton in order to minimise soft tissue > : injuries. If you made the belts wider, the loads would be applied in places > : that would increase injury, such as cutting into the side of the neck, or > : coming up over the top of the hip bones and having the top edge of the belt > : cut into the intestines. > : > > While I see sence in your explanation I cant help wonder why Racing harnesses are three to four > inches wide!?!?!? Probably because a full racing harness is very different to a normal seat belt, they have 2 straps that come over your shoulders plus the crotch belt that stops you "submarining" or sliding forward and down out of the belt, in a race situation harness's are also done up so tightly you can barely move. Daryl |