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From: Brimstone on 31 Jul 2010 02:44 "Harry Bloomfield" <harry.m1byt(a)NOSPAM.tiscali.co.uk> wrote in message news:mn.f9cb7da76f35771d.106911(a)NOSPAM.tiscali.co.uk... > Brimstone laid this down on his screen : >> "Harry Bloomfield" <harry.m1byt(a)NOSPAM.tiscali.co.uk> wrote in message >> news:mn.f5797da79987e554.106911(a)NOSPAM.tiscali.co.uk... >>> on 30/07/2010, GT supposed : >>>> I don't agree with the statement about the silver car's 'bad >>>> positioning'. He was in the normal lane. Once the overtaking cars had >>>> passed, >>> >>> They were not actually overtaking, just both lanes drifting along at >>> fairly similar speeds. >>> >>>> they should have moved back over to the inside lane. Unless the silver >>>> car was playing 'silly buggers' and speeding up / slowing down, then >>>> the problem is much a far reaching 'bad lane etiquette' problem, rife >>>> throughout the UK. >>> >>> I don't think he was varying his speed by much, none the less he seemed >>> always to be in someone's blind spot with plenty of gap ahead of him to >>> move into and remove himself from the danger. >>> >>>> The inside lane is for everyone - the outer lanes are for overtaking. >>>> Move back to the inside lane when finished overtaking, even if you plan >>>> to overtake another vehicle in 40 seconds time. In my experience, >>>> driving on the continent for about 10 minutes shows how lanes should >>>> work - we just don't 'get it' in the UK! >>> >>> I agree completely. How come L1 and L2 can be totally devoid of any >>> vehicles for half a mile, yet there is a very dodgy nose to tail queue >>> in L3 for all of that distance as happened three times this tea time on >>> the A1/M. It makes absolutely no sense and it is very, very dangerous. >>> >>> Why do they all need to form a queue and make the delays so much worse? >>> >> Because they're all waiting for the sluggard ahead to get out of the way. > > I appreciate that, but why not use the other lanes so a safe distance can > be maintained? > Because they're all waiting for the sluggard ahead to get out of the way and they would lose their place in the queue.
From: Ian Jackson on 31 Jul 2010 03:29 In message <Wd2dnWNY2urIW87RnZ2dnUVZ7omdnZ2d(a)bt.com>, Brimstone <brimstone(a)hotmail.com> writes > >"Harry Bloomfield" <harry.m1byt(a)NOSPAM.tiscali.co.uk> wrote in message >news:mn.f9cb7da76f35771d.106911(a)NOSPAM.tiscali.co.uk... >> Brimstone laid this down on his screen : >>> "Harry Bloomfield" <harry.m1byt(a)NOSPAM.tiscali.co.uk> wrote in >>>message news:mn.f5797da79987e554.106911(a)NOSPAM.tiscali.co.uk... >>>> on 30/07/2010, GT supposed : >>>>> I don't agree with the statement about the silver car's 'bad >>>>>positioning'. He was in the normal lane. Once the overtaking cars >>>>>had passed, >>>> >>>> They were not actually overtaking, just both lanes drifting along >>>>fairly similar speeds. >>>> >>>>> they should have moved back over to the inside lane. Unless the >>>>>silver car was playing 'silly buggers' and speeding up / slowing >>>>>down, then the problem is much a far reaching 'bad lane etiquette' >>>>>problem, rife throughout the UK. >>>> >>>> I don't think he was varying his speed by much, none the less he >>>>seemed always to be in someone's blind spot with plenty of gap >>>>ahead of him to move into and remove himself from the danger. >>>> >>>>> The inside lane is for everyone - the outer lanes are for >>>>>overtaking. Move back to the inside lane when finished overtaking, >>>>>even if you plan to overtake another vehicle in 40 seconds time. >>>>>In my experience, driving on the continent for about 10 minutes >>>>>shows how lanes should work - we just don't 'get it' in the UK! >>>> >>>> I agree completely. How come L1 and L2 can be totally devoid of any >>>>vehicles for half a mile, yet there is a very dodgy nose to tail >>>>queue in L3 for all of that distance as happened three times this >>>>tea time on the A1/M. It makes absolutely no sense and it is very, >>>>very dangerous. >>>> >>>> Why do they all need to form a queue and make the delays so much worse? >>>> >>> Because they're all waiting for the sluggard ahead to get out of the way. >> >> I appreciate that, but why not use the other lanes so a safe distance >>can be maintained? >> >Because they're all waiting for the sluggard ahead to get out of the >way and they would lose their place in the queue. > The reason for the queue in L3 is quite simple: The 'sluggard ahead' in L3 (Car 1) is actually going very fast (say 90mph). Someone going even faster (Car 2, at, say, 95mph) comes up behind him, expecting Car 1 to get out of the way (which indeed he should). He comes up close behind Car 1. The 'sluggard' in Car 1 does not get out of the way. The Car 2 guy behind realises that he is dangerously close, and slows down to 85mph for a few seconds to establish a longer gap. Car 3 (at 90mph) is coming up rapidly behind Car 2, and is getting too close. He realises that Car 2 has slowed, and does likewise (to 80mph, to widen the gap). Car 4 (at 85mph) now is coming up rapidly behind Car 3, and is getting too close. He realises that Car 3 has slowed, and does likewise (to 75mph, to widen the gap). Car 5 (at 80mph) now is coming up rapidly behind Car 4, and is getting too close. He realises that Car 4 has slowed, and does likewise (to 70mph, to widen the gap). Car 6 (at 75mph) now is coming up rapidly behind Car 5, and is getting too close. He realises that Car 5 has slowed, and does likewise (to 65mph, to widen the gap). Car 7 (at 70mph) now is coming up rapidly behind Car 6, and is getting too close. He realises that Car 6 has slowed, and does likewise (to 60mph, to widen the gap). As a result, Car 8, who had been pottering along at 70mph in L1, and had been passed by all these fast guys in L3, has caught up with the 60mph Car 7 at tail end of the queue in L3. All the time, of course, L2 has been empty. The question is, what does Car 8 do next? -- Ian
From: Brimstone on 31 Jul 2010 03:43 "Ian Jackson" <ianREMOVETHISjackson(a)g3ohx.demon.co.uk> wrote in message news:1cQcFxBeD9UMFwd8(a)g3ohx.demon.co.uk... > In message <Wd2dnWNY2urIW87RnZ2dnUVZ7omdnZ2d(a)bt.com>, Brimstone > <brimstone(a)hotmail.com> writes >> >>"Harry Bloomfield" <harry.m1byt(a)NOSPAM.tiscali.co.uk> wrote in message >>news:mn.f9cb7da76f35771d.106911(a)NOSPAM.tiscali.co.uk... >>> Brimstone laid this down on his screen : >>>> "Harry Bloomfield" <harry.m1byt(a)NOSPAM.tiscali.co.uk> wrote in message >>>> news:mn.f5797da79987e554.106911(a)NOSPAM.tiscali.co.uk... >>>>> on 30/07/2010, GT supposed : >>>>>> I don't agree with the statement about the silver car's 'bad >>>>>> positioning'. He was in the normal lane. Once the overtaking cars had >>>>>> passed, >>>>> >>>>> They were not actually overtaking, just both lanes drifting along >>>>> fairly similar speeds. >>>>> >>>>>> they should have moved back over to the inside lane. Unless the >>>>>> silver car was playing 'silly buggers' and speeding up / slowing >>>>>> down, then the problem is much a far reaching 'bad lane etiquette' >>>>>> problem, rife throughout the UK. >>>>> >>>>> I don't think he was varying his speed by much, none the less he >>>>> seemed always to be in someone's blind spot with plenty of gap ahead >>>>> of him to move into and remove himself from the danger. >>>>> >>>>>> The inside lane is for everyone - the outer lanes are for overtaking. >>>>>> Move back to the inside lane when finished overtaking, even if you >>>>>> plan to overtake another vehicle in 40 seconds time. In my >>>>>> experience, driving on the continent for about 10 minutes shows how >>>>>> lanes should work - we just don't 'get it' in the UK! >>>>> >>>>> I agree completely. How come L1 and L2 can be totally devoid of any >>>>> vehicles for half a mile, yet there is a very dodgy nose to tail queue >>>>> in L3 for all of that distance as happened three times this tea time >>>>> on the A1/M. It makes absolutely no sense and it is very, very >>>>> dangerous. >>>>> >>>>> Why do they all need to form a queue and make the delays so much >>>>> worse? >>>>> >>>> Because they're all waiting for the sluggard ahead to get out of the >>>> way. >>> >>> I appreciate that, but why not use the other lanes so a safe distance >>> can be maintained? >>> >>Because they're all waiting for the sluggard ahead to get out of the way >>and they would lose their place in the queue. >> > The reason for the queue in L3 is quite simple: > > The 'sluggard ahead' in L3 (Car 1) is actually going very fast (say > 90mph). > > Someone going even faster (Car 2, at, say, 95mph) comes up behind him, > expecting Car 1 to get out of the way (which indeed he should). He comes > up close behind Car 1. > > The 'sluggard' in Car 1 does not get out of the way. The Car 2 guy behind > realises that he is dangerously close, and slows down to 85mph for a few > seconds to establish a longer gap. > > Car 3 (at 90mph) is coming up rapidly behind Car 2, and is getting too > close. He realises that Car 2 has slowed, and does likewise (to 80mph, to > widen the gap). > > Car 4 (at 85mph) now is coming up rapidly behind Car 3, and is getting too > close. He realises that Car 3 has slowed, and does likewise (to 75mph, to > widen the gap). > > Car 5 (at 80mph) now is coming up rapidly behind Car 4, and is getting too > close. He realises that Car 4 has slowed, and does likewise (to 70mph, to > widen the gap). > > Car 6 (at 75mph) now is coming up rapidly behind Car 5, and is getting too > close. He realises that Car 5 has slowed, and does likewise (to 65mph, to > widen the gap). > > Car 7 (at 70mph) now is coming up rapidly behind Car 6, and is getting too > close. He realises that Car 6 has slowed, and does likewise (to 60mph, to > widen the gap). > > As a result, Car 8, who had been pottering along at 70mph in L1, and had > been passed by all these fast guys in L3, has caught up with the 60mph Car > 7 at tail end of the queue in L3. All the time, of course, L2 has been > empty. > > The question is, what does Car 8 do next? > Which is a very long winded way of saying that they're all waiting for the sluggard in front to get out of the way.
From: Ian Jackson on 31 Jul 2010 05:18 In message <JJednYlw1aOGSc7RnZ2dnUVZ8n2dnZ2d(a)bt.com>, Brimstone <brimstone(a)hotmail.com> writes > >"Ian Jackson" <ianREMOVETHISjackson(a)g3ohx.demon.co.uk> wrote in message >news:1cQcFxBeD9UMFwd8(a)g3ohx.demon.co.uk... >> In message <Wd2dnWNY2urIW87RnZ2dnUVZ7omdnZ2d(a)bt.com>, Brimstone >><brimstone(a)hotmail.com> writes >>> >>>"Harry Bloomfield" <harry.m1byt(a)NOSPAM.tiscali.co.uk> wrote in >>>message news:mn.f9cb7da76f35771d.106911(a)NOSPAM.tiscali.co.uk... >>>> Brimstone laid this down on his screen : >>>>> "Harry Bloomfield" <harry.m1byt(a)NOSPAM.tiscali.co.uk> wrote in >>>>>message news:mn.f5797da79987e554.106911(a)NOSPAM.tiscali.co.uk... >>>>>> on 30/07/2010, GT supposed : >>>>>>> I don't agree with the statement about the silver car's 'bad >>>>>>>positioning'. He was in the normal lane. Once the overtaking cars >>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> They were not actually overtaking, just both lanes drifting along >>>>>>fairly similar speeds. >>>>>> >>>>>>> they should have moved back over to the inside lane. Unless the >>>>>>>silver car was playing 'silly buggers' and speeding up / slowing >>>>>>>down, then the problem is much a far reaching 'bad lane >>>>>>>etiquette' problem, rife throughout the UK. >>>>>> >>>>>> I don't think he was varying his speed by much, none the less he >>>>>>seemed always to be in someone's blind spot with plenty of gap >>>>>>ahead of him to move into and remove himself from the danger. >>>>>> >>>>>>> The inside lane is for everyone - the outer lanes are for >>>>>>>overtaking. Move back to the inside lane when finished >>>>>>>overtaking, even if you plan to overtake another vehicle in 40 >>>>>>>experience, driving on the continent for about 10 minutes shows >>>>>>>how lanes should work - we just don't 'get it' in the UK! >>>>>> >>>>>> I agree completely. How come L1 and L2 can be totally devoid of >>>>>>any vehicles for half a mile, yet there is a very dodgy nose to >>>>>>tail queue in L3 for all of that distance as happened three times >>>>>>this tea time on the A1/M. It makes absolutely no sense and it >>>>>>is very, very dangerous. >>>>>> >>>>>> Why do they all need to form a queue and make the delays so much >>>>>>worse? >>>>>> >>>>> Because they're all waiting for the sluggard ahead to get out of >>>>>way. >>>> >>>> I appreciate that, but why not use the other lanes so a safe >>>>distance can be maintained? >>>> >>>Because they're all waiting for the sluggard ahead to get out of the >>>way and they would lose their place in the queue. >>> >> The reason for the queue in L3 is quite simple: >> >> The 'sluggard ahead' in L3 (Car 1) is actually going very fast (say >>90mph). >> >> Someone going even faster (Car 2, at, say, 95mph) comes up behind >>him, expecting Car 1 to get out of the way (which indeed he should). >>He comes up close behind Car 1. >> >> The 'sluggard' in Car 1 does not get out of the way. The Car 2 guy >>behind realises that he is dangerously close, and slows down to 85mph >>for a few seconds to establish a longer gap. >> >> Car 3 (at 90mph) is coming up rapidly behind Car 2, and is getting >>too close. He realises that Car 2 has slowed, and does likewise (to >>80mph, to widen the gap). >> >> Car 4 (at 85mph) now is coming up rapidly behind Car 3, and is >>getting too close. He realises that Car 3 has slowed, and does >>likewise (to 75mph, to widen the gap). >> >> Car 5 (at 80mph) now is coming up rapidly behind Car 4, and is >>getting too close. He realises that Car 4 has slowed, and does >>likewise (to 70mph, to widen the gap). >> >> Car 6 (at 75mph) now is coming up rapidly behind Car 5, and is >>getting too close. He realises that Car 5 has slowed, and does >>likewise (to 65mph, to widen the gap). >> >> Car 7 (at 70mph) now is coming up rapidly behind Car 6, and is >>getting too close. He realises that Car 6 has slowed, and does >>likewise (to 60mph, to widen the gap). >> >> As a result, Car 8, who had been pottering along at 70mph in L1, and >>had been passed by all these fast guys in L3, has caught up with the >>60mph Car 7 at tail end of the queue in L3. All the time, of course, >>L2 has been empty. >> >> The question is, what does Car 8 do next? >> >Which is a very long winded way of saying that they're all waiting for >the sluggard in front to get out of the way. > True. But the point is that the tail end of the queue ends up by moving a lot slower than the sluggard. And they are not waiting for the sluggard. Don't blame him. He turned off the motorway 10 minutes earlier! They are actually only waiting for the car in front to get out of the way. -- Ian
From: Brimstone on 31 Jul 2010 06:03
"Ian Jackson" <ianREMOVETHISjackson(a)g3ohx.demon.co.uk> wrote in message news:K9vD9mIgp+UMFwpJ(a)g3ohx.demon.co.uk... > In message <JJednYlw1aOGSc7RnZ2dnUVZ8n2dnZ2d(a)bt.com>, Brimstone > <brimstone(a)hotmail.com> writes >> >>"Ian Jackson" <ianREMOVETHISjackson(a)g3ohx.demon.co.uk> wrote in message >>news:1cQcFxBeD9UMFwd8(a)g3ohx.demon.co.uk... >>> In message <Wd2dnWNY2urIW87RnZ2dnUVZ7omdnZ2d(a)bt.com>, Brimstone >>> <brimstone(a)hotmail.com> writes >>>> >>>>"Harry Bloomfield" <harry.m1byt(a)NOSPAM.tiscali.co.uk> wrote in message >>>>news:mn.f9cb7da76f35771d.106911(a)NOSPAM.tiscali.co.uk... >>>>> Brimstone laid this down on his screen : >>>>>> "Harry Bloomfield" <harry.m1byt(a)NOSPAM.tiscali.co.uk> wrote in >>>>>> message news:mn.f5797da79987e554.106911(a)NOSPAM.tiscali.co.uk... >>>>>>> on 30/07/2010, GT supposed : >>>>>>>> I don't agree with the statement about the silver car's 'bad >>>>>>>> positioning'. He was in the normal lane. Once the overtaking cars >>>>>>> >>>>>>> They were not actually overtaking, just both lanes drifting along >>>>>>> fairly similar speeds. >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> they should have moved back over to the inside lane. Unless the >>>>>>>> silver car was playing 'silly buggers' and speeding up / slowing >>>>>>>> down, then the problem is much a far reaching 'bad lane etiquette' >>>>>>>> problem, rife throughout the UK. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> I don't think he was varying his speed by much, none the less he >>>>>>> seemed always to be in someone's blind spot with plenty of gap >>>>>>> ahead of him to move into and remove himself from the danger. >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> The inside lane is for everyone - the outer lanes are for >>>>>>>> overtaking. Move back to the inside lane when finished overtaking, >>>>>>>> even if you plan to overtake another vehicle in 40 experience, >>>>>>>> driving on the continent for about 10 minutes shows how lanes >>>>>>>> should work - we just don't 'get it' in the UK! >>>>>>> >>>>>>> I agree completely. How come L1 and L2 can be totally devoid of any >>>>>>> vehicles for half a mile, yet there is a very dodgy nose to tail >>>>>>> queue in L3 for all of that distance as happened three times this >>>>>>> tea time on the A1/M. It makes absolutely no sense and it is very, >>>>>>> very dangerous. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Why do they all need to form a queue and make the delays so much >>>>>>> worse? >>>>>>> >>>>>> Because they're all waiting for the sluggard ahead to get out of way. >>>>> >>>>> I appreciate that, but why not use the other lanes so a safe distance >>>>> can be maintained? >>>>> >>>>Because they're all waiting for the sluggard ahead to get out of the way >>>>and they would lose their place in the queue. >>>> >>> The reason for the queue in L3 is quite simple: >>> >>> The 'sluggard ahead' in L3 (Car 1) is actually going very fast (say >>> 90mph). >>> >>> Someone going even faster (Car 2, at, say, 95mph) comes up behind him, >>> expecting Car 1 to get out of the way (which indeed he should). He comes >>> up close behind Car 1. >>> >>> The 'sluggard' in Car 1 does not get out of the way. The Car 2 guy >>> behind realises that he is dangerously close, and slows down to 85mph >>> for a few seconds to establish a longer gap. >>> >>> Car 3 (at 90mph) is coming up rapidly behind Car 2, and is getting too >>> close. He realises that Car 2 has slowed, and does likewise (to 80mph, >>> to widen the gap). >>> >>> Car 4 (at 85mph) now is coming up rapidly behind Car 3, and is getting >>> too close. He realises that Car 3 has slowed, and does likewise (to >>> 75mph, to widen the gap). >>> >>> Car 5 (at 80mph) now is coming up rapidly behind Car 4, and is getting >>> too close. He realises that Car 4 has slowed, and does likewise (to >>> 70mph, to widen the gap). >>> >>> Car 6 (at 75mph) now is coming up rapidly behind Car 5, and is getting >>> too close. He realises that Car 5 has slowed, and does likewise (to >>> 65mph, to widen the gap). >>> >>> Car 7 (at 70mph) now is coming up rapidly behind Car 6, and is getting >>> too close. He realises that Car 6 has slowed, and does likewise (to >>> 60mph, to widen the gap). >>> >>> As a result, Car 8, who had been pottering along at 70mph in L1, and had >>> been passed by all these fast guys in L3, has caught up with the 60mph >>> Car 7 at tail end of the queue in L3. All the time, of course, L2 has >>> been empty. >>> >>> The question is, what does Car 8 do next? >>> >>Which is a very long winded way of saying that they're all waiting for the >>sluggard in front to get out of the way. >> > True. But the point is that the tail end of the queue ends up by moving a > lot slower than the sluggard. And they are not waiting for the sluggard. > Don't blame him. He turned off the motorway 10 minutes earlier! They are > actually only waiting for the car in front to get out of the way. > I didn't which car was the sluggard. ;-) |