Start/Stop "ECO" cars
in [UK Drivers]
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From: Ed Chilada on 5 May 2010 05:00 On Wed, 5 May 2010 07:49:33 +0100, "Brimstone" <brimstone(a)hotmail.com> wrote: >"Ed Chilada" <nospam(a)nospam.com> wrote in message >news:np01u5da0h7vblj2ihemjid6oiiv14l36d(a)4ax.com... >> On Tue, 04 May 2010 17:20:47 +0100, Harry Bloomfield >> <harry.m1byt(a)NOSPAM.tiscali.co.uk> wrote: >> >>>Brimstone explained : >>>> >>>> "Ed Chilada" <nospam(a)nospam.com> wrote in message >>>> news:2ejvt5hjufmvd4of51su60d9upat0buqsk(a)4ax.com... >>>>> On Tue, 4 May 2010 00:02:27 -0700 (PDT), Martyn H >>>>> <martyn.hodson(a)googlemail.com> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>>On 29 Apr, 22:09, Ed Chilada <nos...(a)nospam.com> wrote: >>>>>>> On Thu, 29 Apr 2010 18:54:47 +0100, Harry Bloomfield >>>>>>> >>>>>>> <harry.m1...(a)NOSPAM.tiscali.co.uk> wrote: >>>>>>> >Ed Chilada wrote : >>>>>>> >> In very slow stop-start motorway traffic, putting your handbrake >>>>>>> >> on/off and your car in and out of neutral every 10 seconds would >>>>>>> >> get >>>>>>> >> old very quickly. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >If you are stopping and starting every 10 seconds then you are doing >>>>>>> >something very silly! >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Such as? >>>>>> >>>>>>being one of the fools who feels that they have to behave like sheep >>>>>>or cattle being driven intoa press in such matters rather than waiting >>>>>>for a reasonable gap ( or the order of 10s of metters to open up and >>>>>>then moving up ) >>>>> >>>>> And what would happen to the rear of the queue if everyone decided to >>>>> wait for a "reasonable" gap before bothering to move forward? >>>>> >>>> It would keep moving at a very slow pace. Try it some time. >>> >>>Quite right! >> >> Quite wrong. It would take a *lot* longer to even start moving, during >> which time even more traffic would be building up behind it. >> >> >>>There is nothing worse in a queue, than everyone racing forward and >>>banging on their brakes. Even one driver with the sense to not do that, >>>but to trickle forward only when there is a worth while space smoothes >>>out the flow - but it can only work so far back, as the first driver >>>who again wants to race forward. >> >> People attempting to "smooth out the flow", simply slow the progress >> of the jam and make it worse than it needs to be. They also invariably >> get people swapping lanes in front of them. It's like how everyone who >> slows to rubberneck thinks they're only causing a fractional delay. >> >How do you know, have you ever done it? You don't have to do something in order to observe it. Slow moving traffic gives you lots of opportunity to observe what people do - like how those people who keep moving lanes very rarely get anywhere and often end up worse off than they were.
From: NM on 5 May 2010 05:02 On 4 May, 21:59, Ed Chilada <nos...(a)nospam.com> wrote: > People attempting to "smooth out the flow", simply slow the progress > of the jam and make it worse than it needs to be. They also invariably > get people swapping lanes in front of them. I don't subscribe to this view, have you any evidence? A public information film on Dutch TV say different. What is wrong with the impatient swapping lanes, more often than not they swap back again fairly quickly. 'Er indoors swaps lanes and won't let the grass grow under her front bumper whereas I just select first or second gear and tickover at a fairly constant speed until either the traffic totally stops or all is moving again.
From: Ed Chilada on 5 May 2010 06:20 On Wed, 5 May 2010 02:02:24 -0700 (PDT), NM <nik.morgan(a)mac.com> wrote: >On 4 May, 21:59, Ed Chilada <nos...(a)nospam.com> wrote: > >> People attempting to "smooth out the flow", simply slow the progress >> of the jam and make it worse than it needs to be. They also invariably >> get people swapping lanes in front of them. > >I don't subscribe to this view, have you any evidence? A public >information film on Dutch TV say different. Which statement are you referring to? I'm guessing the first, so I'll answer accordingly. Evidence? Observation and common sense. If everyone waited longer before setting off in an attempt to reduce their own stop/start then everyone is impacted by a slightly later set off time, which will soon add up along the queue to potentially minutes later by the time you get to the back of the queue (easily minutes if everyone waits 10 seconds). This will of course result in more people joining the queue etc.. etc.. Alternatively, if only one person does it and everyone else sets off immediately to create a funeral procession, then it's nigh on impossible for the lead car to successfully maintain a rolling speed without either catching up the car in front when it stops or getting so far behind as to elongate and exaggerate the jam. >What is wrong with the impatient swapping lanes, more often than not >they swap back again fairly quickly. Nothing massively wrong with it (assuming people look out for motorbikes whizzing up the middle as they usually do in these conditions), it's just usually pointless and it can be amusing when it doesn't work out. That said, it does show a kind of selfish attitude WRT how important these people believe their journey is compared to everyone else. Perhaps it shows a pretty bad trait - people reacting to frustration, even though their efforts are rarely rewarded significantly. >'Er indoors swaps lanes and won't let the grass grow under her front >bumper whereas I just select first or second gear and tickover at a >fairly constant speed until either the traffic totally stops or all is >moving again. You sound like a calm driver. Your missus doesn't.
From: Brimstone on 5 May 2010 08:14 "Ed Chilada" <nospam(a)nospam.com> wrote in message news:cnc2u5pfn32j5bghqnt714u47jit0rs1pg(a)4ax.com... > On Wed, 5 May 2010 07:49:33 +0100, "Brimstone" <brimstone(a)hotmail.com> > wrote: > >>"Ed Chilada" <nospam(a)nospam.com> wrote in message >>news:np01u5da0h7vblj2ihemjid6oiiv14l36d(a)4ax.com... >>> People attempting to "smooth out the flow", simply slow the progress >>> of the jam and make it worse than it needs to be. They also invariably >>> get people swapping lanes in front of them. It's like how everyone who >>> slows to rubberneck thinks they're only causing a fractional delay. >>> >>How do you know, have you ever done it? > > You don't have to do something in order to observe it. There's no substitute for experience and since very few people do I suspect you've not seen it.
From: Ed Chilada on 5 May 2010 09:36
On Wed, 5 May 2010 13:14:41 +0100, "Brimstone" <brimstone(a)hotmail.com> wrote: > > >"Ed Chilada" <nospam(a)nospam.com> wrote in message >news:cnc2u5pfn32j5bghqnt714u47jit0rs1pg(a)4ax.com... >> On Wed, 5 May 2010 07:49:33 +0100, "Brimstone" <brimstone(a)hotmail.com> >> wrote: >> >>>"Ed Chilada" <nospam(a)nospam.com> wrote in message >>>news:np01u5da0h7vblj2ihemjid6oiiv14l36d(a)4ax.com... > >>>> People attempting to "smooth out the flow", simply slow the progress >>>> of the jam and make it worse than it needs to be. They also invariably >>>> get people swapping lanes in front of them. It's like how everyone who >>>> slows to rubberneck thinks they're only causing a fractional delay. >>>> >>>How do you know, have you ever done it? >> >> You don't have to do something in order to observe it. > >There's no substitute for experience I have experience of observing it, both of being behind someone who is doing it and in an adjacent lane to someone who is doing it. In order to determine the effects of a behaviour, it is not important that I'm the one exhibiting the behaviour. In fact, it may well be detrimental. > and since very few people do I've seen it loads of times! > I suspect you've not seen it. Riiight... |