Toyota Corolla May Be Recalled over Steering Problem
in [Technical]
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From: ChrisCoaster on 18 Feb 2010 18:11 On Feb 18, 5:57 pm, dsi1 <d...(a)humuhumunukunukuapuapa.org> wrote: > > The good news is that we'll probably still have caster, camber and > toe-in adjustments. What's SAI? > > > > - Show quoted text - ______________ It's a difficult angle to explain, but pretty there's an invisible line(like the earth's axis) around which a tire rotates as the wheel is turned. Facing the car dead on, this steering axis is inclined so that it angles in at the top(toward the middle of the car). This is not to be confused with camber, which is the tilt of the TIRE itself in(negative camber) or out(positive). The past 20 years it's been called Steering-Axis-Inclination. Some truckers and old-timers still call it Kingpin. It's function is to create lift as you steer the wheels away from a dead-ahead. The wheels want to go down into the ground - which is impossible - so the nose lifts, just perceptibly, as you turn the car's wheels. When you let go the steering wheel, or let it slide through your hands, the car's weight forces the wheels back to a dead- ahead(in an ideal world!). This is the same counterweight you feel when you turn the steering wheel to make a turn -either in a no-PS or a car with variable-PS and you're at moderate to high speeds. And in overboosted PS(hydraulic OR electric) you feel less of that weight as you move the wheel away form a dead-ahead. How, will someone please enlighten me, is that a good thing? I want to KNOW when the wheels are in a position other than straight-ahead. 60s-70s domestic full- sizes were notorious for this numb-feel! Add in a few brewskis and try negoitiating something like that(or a 09 Corolla) through the back- country turns and see how U make out. ;) That is the exact feeling - that communication between the steering/ suspension & the road - most of us "luddites" are afraid to lose during the fly-by-wire transition. -CC
From: ChrisCoaster on 18 Feb 2010 18:14 On Feb 18, 5:57 pm, dsi1 <d...(a)humuhumunukunukuapuapa.org> wrote: > The good news is that we'll probably still have caster, camber and > toe-in adjustments. What's SAI? > > > - Show quoted text - ______________ It's a difficult angle to explain, but pretty there's an invisible line(like the earth's axis) around which a tire rotates as the wheel is turned. Facing the car dead on, this steering axis is inclined so that it angles in at the top(toward the middle of the car). This is not to be confused with camber, which is the tilt of the TIRE itself in(negative camber) or out(positive). The past 20 years it's been called Steering-Axis-Inclination. Some truckers and old-timers still call it Kingpin. It's function is to create lift as you steer the wheels away from a dead-ahead. The wheels want to go down into the ground - which is impossible - so the nose lifts, just perceptibly, as you turn the car's wheels. When you let go the steering wheel, or let it slide through your hands, the car's weight forces the wheels back to a dead- ahead(in an ideal world!). This is the same counterweight you feel when you turn the steering wheel to make a turn -either in a no-PS or a car with variable-PS and you're at moderate to high speeds. And in overboosted PS(hydraulic OR electric) you feel less of that weight as you move the wheel away form a dead-ahead. How, will someone please enlighten me, is that a good thing? I want to KNOW when the wheels are in a position other than straight-ahead. 60s-70s domestic full- sizes were notorious for this numb-feel! Add in a few brewskis and try negoitiating something like that(or a 09 Corolla) through the back- country turns and see how U make out. ;) The strong centered feeling and self-return - that communication between the steering/ suspension & the road - most of us "luddites" are afraid to lose during the fly-by-wire transition. -CC
From: ChrisCoaster on 18 Feb 2010 18:19 On Feb 18, 6:14 pm, ChrisCoaster <ckozi...(a)snet.net> wrote: > On Feb 18, 5:57 pm, dsi1 <d...(a)humuhumunukunukuapuapa.org> wrote: > > > The good news is that we'll probably still have caster, camber and > > toe-in adjustments. What's SAI? > > > - Show quoted text - > > ______________ > It's a difficult angle to explain, but pretty there's an invisible > line(like the earth's axis) around which a tire rotates as the wheel > is turned. Facing the car dead on, this steering axis is inclined so > that it angles in at the top(toward the middle of the car). This is > not to be confused with camber, which is the tilt of the TIRE itself > in(negative camber) or out(positive). > > The past 20 years it's been called Steering-Axis-Inclination. Some > truckers and old-timers still call it Kingpin. > > It's function is to create lift as you steer the wheels away from a > dead-ahead. The wheels want to go down into the ground - which is > impossible - so the nose lifts, just perceptibly, as you turn the > car's wheels. When you let go the steering wheel, or let it slide > through your hands, the car's weight forces the wheels back to a > dead- > ahead(in an ideal world!). This is the same counterweight you feel > when you turn the steering wheel to make a turn -either in a no-PS or > a car with variable-PS and you're at moderate to high speeds. And > in > overboosted PS(hydraulic OR electric) you feel less of that weight as > you move the wheel away form a dead-ahead. How, will someone please > enlighten me, is that a good thing? I want to KNOW when the wheels > are in a position other than straight-ahead. 60s-70s domestic full- > sizes were notorious for this numb-feel! Add in a few brewskis and > try negoitiating something like that(or a 09 Corolla) through the > back- > country turns and see how U make out. ;) > > The strong centered feeling and self-return - that communication > between the steering/ > suspension & the road - most of us "luddites" are afraid to lose > during the fly-by-wire transition. > > -CC ____________ Correction: pretty MUCH there's an invisible line!! OMG I sound like our last "president" when I type! -CC
From: Hachiroku ハチロク on 18 Feb 2010 19:15 On Thu, 18 Feb 2010 09:02:26 -0500, dr_jeff wrote: > Tegger wrote: >> dr_jeff <utz(a)msu.edu> wrote in >> news:dLCdnXPoScvi2-DWnZ2dnUVZ_rWdnZ2d(a)giganews.com: >> >>> Tegger wrote: >>>> john <johngdole(a)hotmail.com> wrote in >>>> news:13e57575-ca27-4b87-b2a5-d7aff4b207f9(a)s36g2000prh.googlegroups.com >>>> : >>>> : >>>>> Veered sharply at highway speeds? Must be junk design. >>>> >>>> Or an unsubstantiated allegation, which most of these "complaints" are >>>> at this point. >>> That's true of the brake problems. >> >> >> >> It's also true of the new PS thing. The NHTSA has said so. >> >> >> >>> Apparently, Toyota and the NHTSA >>> failed to address the reports and take appropriate action, leading to a >>> big mess. >> >> >> The "big mess" is in the media alone. So far, ONE death confirmed as >> being specifically due to a stuck gas pedal. > > How do you confirm that a death is due to a stuck gas pedal? Do you have > to call in to 9-1-1 and say that you're going to die from a stuck gas > pedal? A stuck gas pedal is a really hard thing to confirm. Not really. The ECU stores throttle position information and engine revs for something like three cycles. It would be very easy to determine which deaths were caused by a fault in the system and which were just poor driving habits. Nobody has really presented any hard evidence. When someone does I might change my stance on Toyota's Mea Culpa.
From: Hachiroku ハチロク on 18 Feb 2010 19:16
On Thu, 18 Feb 2010 11:03:58 -0500, Mike Hunter wrote: > (Cross posting deleted, automatically) > >> OK, then we have NO deaths confirmed as being due to a stuck gas pedal. >> >> What a witch-hunt???? >> >> -- >> Tegger > > Can we assume you have not seen the news lately, if that is what you > choose to believe. > > Search "Toyota Class Action Litigation" and you will find numerous > listings like this: > Law firms form consortium in Toyota recall litigation Posted On: Feb. 11, > 2010 2:24 PM CENTRAL | Add a comment Roberto Ceniceros > SAN DIEGOAbout 25 law firms seeking class action status for lawsuits > filed against Toyota Motor Corp. in more than 20 states have formed a > consortium, an attorney coordinating the group said Thursday. > > > "Approximately 20 other lawsuits seeking class action status on behalf of > consumers also have been filed against the automaker because of > accelerator problems that have led to the recall of more than 8 million > automobiles. > > > Those 40 suits do not include individual personal injury claims that > consumers have filed against Toyota. > > > Tim Howard, coordinator of the Attorneys Toyota Action Consortium, said a > court hearing on whether all the class action cases will be consolidated > is expected March 25 before a multidistrict panel in U.S. District Court > in San Diego. > > > Mr. Howard is a professor of law and policy at Northeastern University and > an attorney at Howard Associates P.A. in Tallahassee, Fla. > > > The lawsuits seeking class action status share common allegations that > consumers lost value in and the use of their cars because of defective > parts that sparked the recall. > > > Total damages sought in the consolidated class actions could exceed $2 > billion, based on a calculation that millions of cars lost hundreds of > dollars in value and their owners lost the use of their cars while they > were unsafe to drive or were being repaired, Mr. Howard said. > > > The value is diminished because once someone knows your car might be a > poltergeist car, people dont have to take that kind of risk, Mr. > Howard said. They can find other cars on the market. Even if they solve > (the problems), that lingering fear is going to affect the consciousness > of the consumer. > > > Toyota also is facing securities-related class action litigation. > > > For example, the San Diego-based law firm of Coughlin Stoia Geller Rudman > & Robbins L.L.P. said Monday that it had filed a lawsuit in the U.S. > District Court for the Central District of California on behalf of people > who purchased Toyota securities between Aug. 4, 2009, and Feb. 2, 2010. > > > The complaint alleges that Toyota and some of its officers and directors > misled investors by failing to disclose design defects, causing its stock > to trade at artificially inflated prices during the class period. And no where is data taken from the ECU mentioned. |