Traffic Engineering term for "Sloth"
in [Drive]
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From: Larry G on 1 May 2010 17:59 On Apr 29, 11:24 pm, The Chief Instigator <patr...(a)io.com> wrote: > On Thu, 29 Apr 2010 03:05:16 -0700, Peter Lawrence <hummb...(a)aol.com> wrote: > > On 4/29/10 2:52 AM, Alan Baker wrote: > >> In article<hras8j$op...(a)news.eternal-september.org>, > >> Peter Lawrence<hummb...(a)aol.com> wrote: > >>> On 4/28/10 6:35 PM, Alan Baker wrote: > > >>>> It wouldn't matter than advisory limits are set too low if they were > >>>> always set too low by the same proportion. The trouble comes when you > >>>> occasionally encounter one that is actually indicating what speed you > >>>> really need to be driving. > > >>> But in California (and I've driving all over California), I've never ran > >>> into that problem. All that advisory signs have been set consistently too > >>> low, IMHO. Again, I don't know about other states (or provinces), but in > >>> California they have always been on the low side, consistently. > > >> Everywhere I've ever driven, advisory limits have been set too low for > >> typical passenger vehicles under good driving conditions... > > >> ...except... > > >> ...every now and then you find one that is set approximately correctly.. > > >> And at that point, you're suddenly in trouble, because in your head > >> you've assumed it will be like all the others. > > > Except that's a straw man argument in regards to California, because in all > > my years of driving in California, from the Oregon border down to the > > Mexican border, from the Pacific, through Central Valley and the Sierras and > > in the desert, not once have I encountered an advisory sign where I couldn't > > take the curve *easily* at 30% above the advisory speed. Not once. > > > - Peter > > Try crossing Black Mountain on KY/VA 160...there are more than a few curves > posted at 40 or 50 MPH, and 35 at one 190° curve about a third of the way > down (eastward) on the Virginia side. yup... I've seen advisory speeds higher than I like on some roads..but not freeways
From: Larry G on 1 May 2010 18:00 On Apr 29, 10:09 am, Scott in SoCal <scottenazt...(a)yahoo.com> wrote: > Last time on rec.autos.driving, Alan Baker <alangba...(a)telus.net> > said: > > >Everywhere I've ever driven, advisory limits have been set too low for > >typical passenger vehicles under good driving conditions... > > >...except... > > >...every now and then you find one that is set approximately correctly. > > >And at that point, you're suddenly in trouble, because in your head > >you've assumed it will be like all the others. > > You're only in trouble if you're an incompetent driver. People who > actually know how to drive can judge the appropriate speed for a curve > with an incorrect sign or even no sign at all. exactly right. you should not need a friggin sign to tell you in the first place. your eyes, hands, butt an brain should be fully engaged an the sign - a data point not the bible from on high.
From: Larry G on 1 May 2010 18:01 On Apr 29, 9:39 pm, Scott in SoCal <scottenazt...(a)yahoo.com> wrote: > Last time on rec.autos.driving, Patrick Scheible <k...(a)zipcon.net> > said: > > > > > > >Brent <tetraethylleadREMOVET...(a)yahoo.com> writes: > > >> On 2010-04-29, Scott in SoCal <scottenazt...(a)yahoo.com> wrote: > >> > Last time on rec.autos.driving, Alan Baker <alangba...(a)telus.net> > >> > said: > > >> >>Everywhere I've ever driven, advisory limits have been set too low for > >> >>typical passenger vehicles under good driving conditions... > > >> >>...except... > > >> >>...every now and then you find one that is set approximately correctly. > > >> >>And at that point, you're suddenly in trouble, because in your head > >> >>you've assumed it will be like all the others. > > >> > You're only in trouble if you're an incompetent driver. People who > >> > actually know how to drive can judge the appropriate speed for a curve > >> > with an incorrect sign or even no sign at all. > > >> sometimes you can't quite see what sort of curve it is where the first > >> sign is posted so when the sign is there you use it. If the sign is > >> misleading by not being like the others, then some hard braking might be > >> needed when the curve comes into view such that it can be read well. > > >Exactly. There's a right angle corner that could be taken at 20 mph > >near hear, but it's signed for 15 mainly because hedges obscure the > >view around it and traffic is often backed up to just past the corner. > > A competent driver never overdrives his sight lines; hence even this > warning sign is superfluous to the competent. a competent driver - drives by sight lines.. not signs....
From: Larry G on 1 May 2010 18:03 On Apr 30, 8:24 am, Brent <tetraethylleadREMOVET...(a)yahoo.com> wrote: > On 2010-04-30, Scott in SoCal <scottenazt...(a)yahoo.com> wrote: > > > > > > > Last time on rec.autos.driving, Patrick Scheible <k...(a)zipcon.net> > > said: > > >>Brent <tetraethylleadREMOVET...(a)yahoo.com> writes: > > >>> On 2010-04-29, Scott in SoCal <scottenazt...(a)yahoo.com> wrote: > >>> > Last time on rec.autos.driving, Alan Baker <alangba...(a)telus.net> > >>> > said: > > >>> >>Everywhere I've ever driven, advisory limits have been set too low for > >>> >>typical passenger vehicles under good driving conditions... > > >>> >>...except... > > >>> >>...every now and then you find one that is set approximately correctly. > > >>> >>And at that point, you're suddenly in trouble, because in your head > >>> >>you've assumed it will be like all the others. > > >>> > You're only in trouble if you're an incompetent driver. People who > >>> > actually know how to drive can judge the appropriate speed for a curve > >>> > with an incorrect sign or even no sign at all. > > >>> sometimes you can't quite see what sort of curve it is where the first > >>> sign is posted so when the sign is there you use it. If the sign is > >>> misleading by not being like the others, then some hard braking might be > >>> needed when the curve comes into view such that it can be read well. > > >>Exactly. There's a right angle corner that could be taken at 20 mph > >>near hear, but it's signed for 15 mainly because hedges obscure the > >>view around it and traffic is often backed up to just past the corner. > > > A competent driver never overdrives his sight lines; hence even this > > warning sign is superfluous to the competent. > > You've never encountered a curve that you could clearly see had no > obstructions within your braking distance but looked like it could be > taken faster until up close to it? Being able to brake down to the > slower speed is not out driving the sight lines, but a misleading sign > is still a misleading sign. If you're saying we shouldn't trust the > signs, then all the signs should be removed. the signs are necessary for the segment of the population that needs them - unfortunately. signs are little more than something put up by another human being who may or may not be an engineer and even if an engineer may or may not have his/her act together.
From: Larry G on 1 May 2010 18:05
On May 1, 12:47 am, Brent <tetraethylleadREMOVET...(a)yahoo.com> wrote: > On 2010-05-01, Scott in SoCal <scottenazt...(a)yahoo.com> wrote: > > > > > > > Last time on rec.autos.driving, Brent > ><tetraethylleadREMOVET...(a)yahoo.com> said: > > >>On 2010-04-30, Scott in SoCal <scottenazt...(a)yahoo.com> wrote: > >>> Last time on rec.autos.driving, Brent > >>><tetraethylleadREMOVET...(a)yahoo.com> said: > > >>>>If you're saying we shouldn't trust the > >>>>signs, then all the signs should be removed. > > >>> Just like everything else, these signs are dumbed-down to the lowest > >>> common denominator. There is undoubtedly some combination of a poor > >>> driver with an unwieldy vehicle for which the speed on the sign is > >>> entirely appropriate. Besides, it will cost taxpayers money to take > >>> the signs down. > > >>If they were all dumbed down, they'd be slow by roughly the same margin.. > > > Only if every government bureaucrat who makes such signs were equally > > (in)competent. > > >>Without consistency the signs are pointless > > > Yes. > > >>and should be removed. > > > But that would waste money. It would probably be cheaper to just fix > > the inconsistent ones. > > I was staying with the theme that we are 'weak', 'lazy', and/or > 'incompetent' for not liking inconsistent signage. If that's the case, > get rid of the signs. All of them. this might be a shock but there are a substantial number of people out there who freak out if there are not signs... these would be the folks who ..even though the sign says "right turn on red after yield" .. can't turn.... |