Tyre sealant stuff - which one?
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From: Doctor D on 31 Jul 2008 12:54 > Interesting, Mike, that both you and "fast_cars_guy" mention a space-saver > tyre. Unfortunately, although it would work for almost 11 months of the > year, holiday time would be the problem. We usually go away for about 4 to > 5 weeks, driving as far as Poland and Hungary, and believe me, that takes > a lot of luggage - and then there's booze to bring back, of course, so > every square inch of boot space is needed in that situation :o) I've just bought a spare wheel and tyre for a tenner off Ebay for my Touran just because I didn't want to go to France for a fortnight without one! Mine lies in the boot wrapped in plastic until I need extra boot space or the extra seats then I remove it, or roll up the parcel shelf and stack it vertically. Having previously broken down on a French (privatised) motorway and had to pay a fortune up front to the recovery service to be taken to their tied garage I don't want to repeat the experience. Yes, you can claim it back off your breakdown service, but it's an unpleasant experience.
From: David Hearn on 1 Aug 2008 04:56 Burgerman wrote: > "DanB" <iridiumdan(a)googlemail.com> wrote in message > news:6fceqmFaqqrnU1(a)mid.individual.net... >> "John" <x(a)y.z> wrote in message >> news:teadndS8iredHw3VnZ2dnUVZ8tninZ2d(a)bt.com... >>> I've just had my car converted to dual fuel and now have a 67-litre >>> LPG tank in the spare wheel well instead of a spare wheel, so can >>> anyone recommend a good tyre sealant? >>> >>> Each of the tyres is in really good condition with between 6 and 7mm >>> tread depth and the rims are alloys - just in case that makes any >>> difference. >>> >>> Cheers, >>> >> >> My car never came with a spare, I have 2 cans of Renault 'Tyre Repair >> Aerosol" - no idea if it's any good mind you :-) >> >> -- >> Dan >> Clio R27 F1 #65 >> > > > I stuck a set of these on. Problem solved. No noticible difference in > ride once the pressure was reduced a few psi from stock. Technically you > need tyre pressure monitors too but thats up to you. No, it's not up to you. They should not be fitted to vehicles which do not have remote pressure sensors. The reason is, once a puncture has occurred, they must be treated as a temporary space saver tyre (or unmatched tyre) - i.e. 50mph/80kph max and only as a get you home type thing. In the link you sent "you can do 100 miles or so at 50 mph all the way home safely". Without remote pressure sensors you have no idea whether you have a puncture, and so could be doing 70mph or whatever. As eTyres says: "The other essential item of safety equipment for a vehicle with Run-flat tyres is a Tyre Pressure Monitoring System (TPMS). Run-flat tyres are designed to minimise the difference in ride quality when a tyre is punctured. This is especially the case with motorway driving where there is relatively little cornering. For this reason it is difficult to determine that a tyre has lost pressure or is operating in zero pressure conditions. Should the driver not be aware of a loss of pressure they may well exceed the safety limits imposed by the manufacturer. This would eventually cause the tyre to fail. Run-flat tyres are not indestructible!" <http://www.etyres.co.uk/run-flat-tyres> D
From: Burgerman on 1 Aug 2008 05:44 "David Hearn" <dave(a)NOswampieSPAM.org.uk> wrote in message news:6fg1erFb8pr5U1(a)mid.individual.net... > Burgerman wrote: >> "DanB" <iridiumdan(a)googlemail.com> wrote in message >> news:6fceqmFaqqrnU1(a)mid.individual.net... >>> "John" <x(a)y.z> wrote in message >>> news:teadndS8iredHw3VnZ2dnUVZ8tninZ2d(a)bt.com... >>>> I've just had my car converted to dual fuel and now have a 67-litre LPG >>>> tank in the spare wheel well instead of a spare wheel, so can anyone >>>> recommend a good tyre sealant? >>>> >>>> Each of the tyres is in really good condition with between 6 and 7mm >>>> tread depth and the rims are alloys - just in case that makes any >>>> difference. >>>> >>>> Cheers, >>>> >>> >>> My car never came with a spare, I have 2 cans of Renault 'Tyre Repair >>> Aerosol" - no idea if it's any good mind you :-) >>> >>> -- >>> Dan >>> Clio R27 F1 #65 >>> >> >> >> I stuck a set of these on. Problem solved. No noticible difference in >> ride once the pressure was reduced a few psi from stock. Technically you >> need tyre pressure monitors too but thats up to you. > > No, it's not up to you. They should not be fitted to vehicles which do > not have remote pressure sensors. The reason is, once a puncture has > occurred, they must be treated as a temporary space saver tyre (or > unmatched tyre) - i.e. 50mph/80kph max and only as a get you home type > thing. In the link you sent "you can do 100 miles or so at 50 mph all the > way home safely". Without remote pressure sensors you have no idea > whether you have a puncture, and so could be doing 70mph or whatever. Wrong. It is up to you. And it was up to me too! And I know all that. Its easy to tell if ones a bit low just by driving it. I tried it by letting 10 psi out. Feels horrible. So I do not need tp sensors. You might but then thats "up to you" isnt it. > As eTyres says: "The other essential item of safety equipment for a > vehicle with Run-flat tyres is a Tyre Pressure Monitoring System (TPMS). > Run-flat tyres are designed to minimise the difference in ride quality > when a tyre is punctured. This is especially the case with motorway > driving where there is relatively little cornering. Yep my gran wouldnt notice if you stole the whole wheel. I on the other hand certainly can, even on the rear. As could most on this group I would hope... For this reason it > is difficult to determine that a tyre has lost pressure or is operating in > zero pressure conditions. Should the driver not be aware of a loss of > pressure they may well exceed the safety limits imposed by the > manufacturer. This would eventually cause the tyre to fail. Run-flat tyres > are not indestructible!" <http://www.etyres.co.uk/run-flat-tyres> > > D As I said your choice! I can easily tell when 10 psi is missing. And you can run a NON run flat at 10 psi down on a motorway at 70 with little likelyhood of a problem. Ask my mum she never checks tyre pressures and they are always half flat... Now she needs tyre pressure monitors on ordinary tyres. I or most of this group dont. Just a bit of "feel" and awareness.
From: David Hearn on 1 Aug 2008 06:23 Burgerman wrote: > "David Hearn" <dave(a)NOswampieSPAM.org.uk> wrote in message > news:6fg1erFb8pr5U1(a)mid.individual.net... >> Burgerman wrote: >>> "DanB" <iridiumdan(a)googlemail.com> wrote in message >>> news:6fceqmFaqqrnU1(a)mid.individual.net... >>>> "John" <x(a)y.z> wrote in message >>>> news:teadndS8iredHw3VnZ2dnUVZ8tninZ2d(a)bt.com... >>>>> I've just had my car converted to dual fuel and now have a 67-litre >>>>> LPG tank in the spare wheel well instead of a spare wheel, so can >>>>> anyone recommend a good tyre sealant? >>>>> >>>>> Each of the tyres is in really good condition with between 6 and >>>>> 7mm tread depth and the rims are alloys - just in case that makes >>>>> any difference. >>>>> >>>>> Cheers, >>>>> >>>> >>>> My car never came with a spare, I have 2 cans of Renault 'Tyre >>>> Repair Aerosol" - no idea if it's any good mind you :-) >>>> >>>> -- >>>> Dan >>>> Clio R27 F1 #65 >>>> >>> >>> >>> I stuck a set of these on. Problem solved. No noticible difference in >>> ride once the pressure was reduced a few psi from stock. Technically >>> you need tyre pressure monitors too but thats up to you. >> >> No, it's not up to you. They should not be fitted to vehicles which >> do not have remote pressure sensors. The reason is, once a puncture >> has occurred, they must be treated as a temporary space saver tyre (or >> unmatched tyre) - i.e. 50mph/80kph max and only as a get you home type >> thing. In the link you sent "you can do 100 miles or so at 50 mph all >> the way home safely". Without remote pressure sensors you have no >> idea whether you have a puncture, and so could be doing 70mph or >> whatever. > > > Wrong. It is up to you. And it was up to me too! And I know all that. > Its easy to tell if ones a bit low just by driving it. I tried it by > letting 10 psi out. Feels horrible. > So I do not need tp sensors. You might but then thats "up to you" isnt it. > > >> As eTyres says: "The other essential item of safety equipment for a >> vehicle with Run-flat tyres is a Tyre Pressure Monitoring System >> (TPMS). Run-flat tyres are designed to minimise the difference in ride >> quality when a tyre is punctured. This is especially the case with >> motorway driving where there is relatively little cornering. > > > Yep my gran wouldnt notice if you stole the whole wheel. I on the other > hand certainly can, even on the rear. As could most on this group I > would hope... > > For this reason it >> is difficult to determine that a tyre has lost pressure or is >> operating in zero pressure conditions. Should the driver not be aware >> of a loss of pressure they may well exceed the safety limits imposed >> by the manufacturer. This would eventually cause the tyre to fail. >> Run-flat tyres are not indestructible!" >> <http://www.etyres.co.uk/run-flat-tyres> >> >> D > > As I said your choice! > I can easily tell when 10 psi is missing. And you can run a NON run flat > at 10 psi down on a motorway at 70 with little likelyhood of a problem. > Ask my mum she never checks tyre pressures and they are always half > flat... Now she needs tyre pressure monitors on ordinary tyres. I or > most of this group dont. Just a bit of "feel" and awareness. Whether you can feel it or not - manufacturers of the tyres say you must not do this. In fact, Michelin say: "This Self Supporting Tyre (SST) technology should only be used on vehicles originally designed for this type of tyre. Do not fit ZP tyres on vehicles not designed for this technology." <http://www.michelin.co.uk/uk/front/affich.jsp?codeRubrique=20060308204909> Goodyear say: "Since your tires will simply keep going after they've suffered pressure loss, RunOnFlat technology requires the presence of an on-board TPMS (Tire Pressure Monitoring System) that lets you know that your tire requires servicing. Without such a system, you would have no way of knowing that your tire had suffered a puncture or a blow out." <http://eu.goodyear.com/home_en/tires/runonflat/> Continental say: "SSR tyres may only be fitted to vehicles equipped with a tyre pressure monitoring system" <http://www.conti-online.com/generator/www/uk/en/continental/portal/general/innovation/ssr_tyres_en.html> Only a few days ago there was discussion on here about asymmetric tyres, and how using them fitted the wrong way around is dangerous, and liable for your insurer to refuse a claim. Likewise, I cannot see how this is any different. If you had an accident, and there was any question over the state of your tyres contributing to the accident and your insurer discovered you were using tyres in a method which was contrary to the manufacturer's requirements, I would expect they would fight the claim. But, as you say - it's up to you. Same with using asymmetric tyres the wrong way round. It's up to you. ;) D
From: Burgerman on 1 Aug 2008 08:47
"David Hearn" <dave(a)NOswampieSPAM.org.uk> wrote in message news:4892E428.7050901(a)NOswampieSPAM.org.uk... > Burgerman wrote: >> "David Hearn" <dave(a)NOswampieSPAM.org.uk> wrote in message >> news:6fg1erFb8pr5U1(a)mid.individual.net... >>> Burgerman wrote: >>>> "DanB" <iridiumdan(a)googlemail.com> wrote in message >>>> news:6fceqmFaqqrnU1(a)mid.individual.net... >>>>> "John" <x(a)y.z> wrote in message >>>>> news:teadndS8iredHw3VnZ2dnUVZ8tninZ2d(a)bt.com... >>>>>> I've just had my car converted to dual fuel and now have a 67-litre >>>>>> LPG tank in the spare wheel well instead of a spare wheel, so can >>>>>> anyone recommend a good tyre sealant? >>>>>> >>>>>> Each of the tyres is in really good condition with between 6 and 7mm >>>>>> tread depth and the rims are alloys - just in case that makes any >>>>>> difference. >>>>>> >>>>>> Cheers, >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> My car never came with a spare, I have 2 cans of Renault 'Tyre Repair >>>>> Aerosol" - no idea if it's any good mind you :-) >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> Dan >>>>> Clio R27 F1 #65 >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> I stuck a set of these on. Problem solved. No noticible difference in >>>> ride once the pressure was reduced a few psi from stock. Technically >>>> you need tyre pressure monitors too but thats up to you. >>> >>> No, it's not up to you. They should not be fitted to vehicles which do >>> not have remote pressure sensors. The reason is, once a puncture has >>> occurred, they must be treated as a temporary space saver tyre (or >>> unmatched tyre) - i.e. 50mph/80kph max and only as a get you home type >>> thing. In the link you sent "you can do 100 miles or so at 50 mph all >>> the way home safely". Without remote pressure sensors you have no idea >>> whether you have a puncture, and so could be doing 70mph or whatever. >> >> >> Wrong. It is up to you. And it was up to me too! And I know all that. >> Its easy to tell if ones a bit low just by driving it. I tried it by >> letting 10 psi out. Feels horrible. >> So I do not need tp sensors. You might but then thats "up to you" isnt >> it. >> >> >>> As eTyres says: "The other essential item of safety equipment for a >>> vehicle with Run-flat tyres is a Tyre Pressure Monitoring System (TPMS). >>> Run-flat tyres are designed to minimise the difference in ride quality >>> when a tyre is punctured. This is especially the case with motorway >>> driving where there is relatively little cornering. >> >> >> Yep my gran wouldnt notice if you stole the whole wheel. I on the other >> hand certainly can, even on the rear. As could most on this group I would >> hope... >> >> For this reason it >>> is difficult to determine that a tyre has lost pressure or is operating >>> in zero pressure conditions. Should the driver not be aware of a loss of >>> pressure they may well exceed the safety limits imposed by the >>> manufacturer. This would eventually cause the tyre to fail. Run-flat >>> tyres are not indestructible!" <http://www.etyres.co.uk/run-flat-tyres> >>> >>> D >> >> As I said your choice! >> I can easily tell when 10 psi is missing. And you can run a NON run flat >> at 10 psi down on a motorway at 70 with little likelyhood of a problem. >> Ask my mum she never checks tyre pressures and they are always half >> flat... Now she needs tyre pressure monitors on ordinary tyres. I or >> most of this group dont. Just a bit of "feel" and awareness. > > Whether you can feel it or not - manufacturers of the tyres say you must > not do this. Because they dont know if its going to be you, me or my mum driving it. And they are scared or getting sued. > In fact, Michelin say: "This Self Supporting Tyre (SST) technology should > only be used on vehicles originally designed for this type of tyre. Do not > fit ZP tyres on vehicles not designed for this technology." > <http://www.michelin.co.uk/uk/front/affich.jsp?codeRubrique=20060308204909> As above. > Goodyear say: "Since your tires will simply keep going after they've > suffered pressure loss, RunOnFlat technology requires the presence of an > on-board TPMS (Tire Pressure Monitoring System) that lets you know that > your tire requires servicing. Without such a system, you would have no way > of knowing that your tire had suffered a puncture or a blow out." > <http://eu.goodyear.com/home_en/tires/runonflat/> Thats untrue. Its easy toi tell. At least for many. If you are my granny then fine as I said its up to you. The tyre pressure monitors are cheap anyway. I dont need one. > > Continental say: "SSR tyres may only be fitted to vehicles equipped with a > tyre pressure monitoring system" > <http://www.conti-online.com/generator/www/uk/en/continental/portal/general/innovation/ssr_tyres_en.html> Of course they do But as I say most people that are "aware" and have a good sense of "feel" and can tell if you have a flat one easily. But maybe my mum couldnt. > Only a few days ago there was discussion on here about asymmetric tyres, > and how using them fitted the wrong way around is dangerous, and liable > for your insurer to refuse a claim. Thats also debatable. There are many assmetric tyres that are matked outside only. They are not mirror images. So on one side even when fitted correctly the water clearing characteristics get reversed! Its mostly "fashion". I and many others have fitted bike tyres reversed with no problems, many club racers do. Most tracks wear out the right side first! http://ssl.delti.com/cgi-bin/rshop.pl?details=Ordern&cart_id=38787955.110.30869&typ=R-147200&ranzahl=4&Breite=235&Quer=45&Felge=18&Speed=H&weiter=0&kategorie=6&Ang_pro_Seite=12&Transport=P&F_F=&dsco=110&sowigan=So&Achse= It may wrap but this is a typical example. These when fitted correctly effectively sift the water inwards on one side and outwards on the other. They are effectively running reversed on the left side of the car. So it cant actually make any difference which way you fit/use them! They are always wrong anyway... Likewise, I cannot see how this is > any different. If you had an accident, and there was any question over > the state of your tyres contributing to the accident and your insurer > discovered you were using tyres in a method which was contrary to the > manufacturer's requirements, I would expect they would fight the claim. That would only stand up in court if the tyre was found to be substantially under inflated. And that would be true for NON run flat tyres too! > > But, as you say - it's up to you. Same with using asymmetric tyres the > wrong way round. It's up to you. ;) > > D |