Which welder
in [Car Maintenance]
|
From: Cicero on 24 Jul 2010 16:32 On Sat, 24 Jul 2010 20:51:00 +0100, Harry Bloomfield wrote: > Jim K brought next idea : >> On 24 July, 19:57, Harry Bloomfield <harry.m1...(a)NOSPAM.tiscali.co.uk> >> wrote: >>> on 23/07/2010, Fredxx supposed : >>> >>> >>> >>>> "Dave Plowman (News)" <d...(a)davenoise.co.uk> wrote in message >>>> news:513b3f1ab8dave(a)davenoise.co.uk... >>>>> In article <i2bjsq$p9...(a)news.eternal-september.org>, >>>>> Fredxx <fre...(a)spam.com> wrote: >>> >>>>>> "Andy Dingley" <ding...(a)codesmiths.com> wrote in message >>>>>> news:de442991- ca06-4e13-8e58-5fbd1a7367fa(a)d37g2000yqm.googlegroups.com... >>>>>>> On 22 July, 20:43, "steve robinson" >>>>>>> <st...(a)colevalleyinteriors.co.uk> wrote: >>> >>>>>>>> Its not that easy to use on car bodywork though as it tends to >>>>>>>> cut through . >>> >>>>>>> Are you using the right welder polarity? >>>>>> I've read an number of articles which suggest it doesn't make much >>>>>> difference and that its more the current/voltage characteristics >>>>>> which are more important. >>> >>>>>> My MIG is wired for gas, and my understanding the ideal polarity is >>>>>> the reverse for gasless wire, yet I can make satisfactory welds. >>>>>> If you have an alternative experience I would like to hear them. >>>>> That's interesting - I have a SIP Migmate for gas only, and would >>>>> like the option of gasless. Do you need any other parts other than >>>>> the wire? >>>> I could only get gasless wire at 0.8mm, whereas with gas I only ever >>>> used 0.6mm. I felt the feed rate ended up being nearly the same. >>>> There is a lot more spatter than using gas. >>> >>>> I have bought gasless wire of eBay and found it ok. I think machine >>>> mart do smaller reels which perhaps you can try out. If I was using >>>> reels of wire I would go for gas in hired bottles, but as I use a >>>> reel every year or 2, gasless is the cheaper option. >>> >>> That is interesting, I have a mig which is designed for gas and the >>> reason I don't make much use of it is the gas. Gasless would be handy >>> if it would be able to use it - how do the gasless ones make contact >>> with the wire though the coating? >>> >>> >> what coating? :>) >> >> Jim K > > I assumed the gas was produced from some sort of coating on the wire, > which I further assumed would not be conductive. Have I misunderstood > how it works, I have never seen any? ============================================================================== It's flux *cored* like electrical solder. Cic. -- =============================================================================== Using Ubuntu Linux Windows shown the door ===============================================================================
From: Harry Bloomfield on 24 Jul 2010 16:37 Cicero formulated the question : > On Sat, 24 Jul 2010 20:51:00 +0100, Harry Bloomfield wrote: > >> Jim K brought next idea : >>> On 24 July, 19:57, Harry Bloomfield <harry.m1...(a)NOSPAM.tiscali.co.uk> >>> wrote: >>>> on 23/07/2010, Fredxx supposed : >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>>> "Dave Plowman (News)" <d...(a)davenoise.co.uk> wrote in message >>>>> news:513b3f1ab8dave(a)davenoise.co.uk... >>>>>> In article <i2bjsq$p9...(a)news.eternal-september.org>, >>>>>> Fredxx <fre...(a)spam.com> wrote: >>>>>>> "Andy Dingley" <ding...(a)codesmiths.com> wrote in message >>>>>>> news:de442991- >>>>>>> ca06-4e13-8e58-5fbd1a7367fa(a)d37g2000yqm.googlegroups.com... >>>>>>>> On 22 July, 20:43, "steve robinson" >>>>>>>> <st...(a)colevalleyinteriors.co.uk> wrote: >>>>>>>>> Its not that easy to use on car bodywork though as it tends to >>>>>>>>> cut through . >>>> >>>>>>>> Are you using the right welder polarity? >>>>>>> I've read an number of articles which suggest it doesn't make much >>>>>>> difference and that its more the current/voltage characteristics >>>>>>> which are more important. >>>> >>>>>>> My MIG is wired for gas, and my understanding the ideal polarity is >>>>>>> the reverse for gasless wire, yet I can make satisfactory welds. >>>>>>> If you have an alternative experience I would like to hear them. >>>>>> That's interesting - I have a SIP Migmate for gas only, and would >>>>>> like the option of gasless. Do you need any other parts other than >>>>>> the wire? >>>>> I could only get gasless wire at 0.8mm, whereas with gas I only ever >>>>> used 0.6mm. I felt the feed rate ended up being nearly the same. >>>>> There is a lot more spatter than using gas. >>>>> I have bought gasless wire of eBay and found it ok. I think machine >>>>> mart do smaller reels which perhaps you can try out. If I was using >>>>> reels of wire I would go for gas in hired bottles, but as I use a >>>>> reel every year or 2, gasless is the cheaper option. >>>> >>>> That is interesting, I have a mig which is designed for gas and the >>>> reason I don't make much use of it is the gas. Gasless would be handy >>>> if it would be able to use it - how do the gasless ones make contact >>>> with the wire though the coating? >>>> >>>> >>> what coating? :>) >>> >>> Jim K >> >> I assumed the gas was produced from some sort of coating on the wire, >> which I further assumed would not be conductive. Have I misunderstood >> how it works, I have never seen any? > > ============================================================================== > > It's flux *cored* like electrical solder. > > Cic. Thanks. Next time I see some, I buy it and see how it goes. I had thought of the 'flux core', but discounted it as impossible to produce with steel. -- Regards, Harry (M1BYT) (L) http://www.ukradioamateur.co.uk
From: Andy Dingley on 24 Jul 2010 16:39 On 24 July, 17:49, Adrian <toomany2...(a)gmail.com> wrote: > Presumably MIG cylinders are perfectly acceptable? There's no distinction drawn. Which is a bit odd really, because acetylene is a vastly more serious hazard than shield gas, propane or even oxygen.
From: Andy Dingley on 24 Jul 2010 16:40 On 24 July, 20:51, Harry Bloomfield <harry.m1...(a)NOSPAM.tiscali.co.uk> wrote: > I assumed the gas was produced from some sort of coating on the wire, I believe it's a coating on thin strip, which is then rolled up and drawn into wire. As far as the finished wire goes, the flux is pretty much internal.
From: Andy Dingley on 24 Jul 2010 16:54
On 24 July, 16:42, Jim K <jk989...(a)googlemail.com> wrote: > strewth... but you do agree you can weld steel together using CO2 as > gas in what's commonly known as a "MIG welding machine"?? By what process though? You can't do spray transfer with CO2, so that's a bunch of useful welding excluded. It also makes it more difficult to do dip transfer. Most industrial welders don't use it, even on thin sheet, unless they have a pulsed transfer machine. Whilst most mixed shielding gases (apart from aluminium and stainless) include a little CO2, this is a minor component that provides free carbon monoxide, thus a little extra energy for polishing the edges of the weld bead. In terms of its bulk properties, particularly thermal conductivity, it's far more like pure argon than pure CO2 and so it handles like it. > http://www.mig-welding.co.uk/welding-gas.htm A "test" where they don't even section, polish & etch the welds afterwards or do a nick-break test, is worthless. |