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From: jackbadger56 on 22 Feb 2007 22:00
At some stage in the next few years we're going to have to re-power
our boat as the twin SD33's are pretty tired. I was thinking (just
thinking!) that fitting modern twin 4cyl turbo-diesels would be worth
exploring. We've yet to get quotes on the Nissans but I'm sure it will
cost a fortune simply because it's for a marine application (diesel
fuel at all the marinas in Pittwater charge about $1.70 per litre, to
give you an idea of what they can get away with). If we were to use a
heat-exchanger set-up rather than pumping seawater through them, would
you really need to do a great deal of modification for marine use? The
'engine room' (wow, that sounds grand!) is pretty well sealed and
there is heaps of room, so maybe any computers etc can be located well
out of harms way. Two of the marine mechanics I've put this to seem to
think it should be OK in theory, but had never put any thought into
it, as they had never been asked. They weren't keen on the idea
basically, but couldn't really give me a reason why. Has anyone here
had experience in fitting stock car engines into boats? If so, do you
think this is feasible?

BTW I've looked for an 'Aus.Boats' to ask this, but am also interested
in what 'car-heads' think of this idea. Traditional boaties are just
too blinded by......well........tradition, and would be horrified at the
thought of doing this to a 60yo Halvorsen (despite the fact that it
currently has Nissan truck motors, which in turn replaced a pair of
Holden sixes!)

From: JD on 22 Feb 2007 22:23
jackbadger56 wrote:

> At some stage in the next few years we're going to have to re-power
> our boat as the twin SD33's are pretty tired. I was thinking (just
> thinking!) that fitting modern twin 4cyl turbo-diesels would be worth
> exploring. We've yet to get quotes on the Nissans but I'm sure it will
> cost a fortune simply because it's for a marine application (diesel
> fuel at all the marinas in Pittwater charge about $1.70 per litre, to
> give you an idea of what they can get away with). If we were to use a
> heat-exchanger set-up rather than pumping seawater through them, would
> you really need to do a great deal of modification for marine use? The
> 'engine room' (wow, that sounds grand!) is pretty well sealed and
> there is heaps of room, so maybe any computers etc can be located well
> out of harms way. Two of the marine mechanics I've put this to seem to
> think it should be OK in theory, but had never put any thought into
> it, as they had never been asked. They weren't keen on the idea
> basically, but couldn't really give me a reason why. Has anyone here
> had experience in fitting stock car engines into boats? If so, do you
> think this is feasible?
>
> BTW I've looked for an 'Aus.Boats' to ask this, but am also interested
> in what 'car-heads' think of this idea. Traditional boaties are just
> too blinded by......well........tradition, and would be horrified at the
> thought of doing this to a 60yo Halvorsen (despite the fact that it
> currently has Nissan truck motors, which in turn replaced a pair of
> Holden sixes!)
There are and have been many "marine" engines that are just this -
conversions of car engines. The major changes are usually fitting a water
cooled exhaust manifold, which will usually have to be designed and made
for the specific engine, and a heat exchanger cooling system. If using a
turbo diesel as proposed, the water cooling would be downstream of the
turbo, and the presence of the turbocharger is likely to require some
thought as to cooling the engine space, possibly forced ventilation. Apart
from this and marrying the marine gearbox to the motor, the major concern
would be keeping the automotive electrics including the ecus dry in a
generally humid and salty atmosphere, but it could be done. Thought would
also be needed to ensure that the engine's lubrication will always be
functioning in heavy seas or, in the case of sailing vessels, when heeled.
The overall cost may well end up more than that that of a similar marine
engine, unless you are doing the work yourself using second hand car
engines.
JD
From: D Walford on 22 Feb 2007 23:52
jackbadger56 wrote:
> At some stage in the next few years we're going to have to re-power
> our boat as the twin SD33's are pretty tired. I was thinking (just
> thinking!) that fitting modern twin 4cyl turbo-diesels would be worth
> exploring. We've yet to get quotes on the Nissans but I'm sure it will
> cost a fortune simply because it's for a marine application (diesel
> fuel at all the marinas in Pittwater charge about $1.70 per litre, to
> give you an idea of what they can get away with). If we were to use a
> heat-exchanger set-up rather than pumping seawater through them, would
> you really need to do a great deal of modification for marine use? The
> 'engine room' (wow, that sounds grand!) is pretty well sealed and
> there is heaps of room, so maybe any computers etc can be located well
> out of harms way. Two of the marine mechanics I've put this to seem to
> think it should be OK in theory, but had never put any thought into
> it, as they had never been asked. They weren't keen on the idea
> basically, but couldn't really give me a reason why. Has anyone here
> had experience in fitting stock car engines into boats? If so, do you
> think this is feasible?
>
> BTW I've looked for an 'Aus.Boats' to ask this, but am also interested
> in what 'car-heads' think of this idea. Traditional boaties are just
> too blinded by......well........tradition, and would be horrified at the
> thought of doing this to a 60yo Halvorsen (despite the fact that it
> currently has Nissan truck motors, which in turn replaced a pair of
> Holden sixes!)
>
I can't think of any technical reason why you couldn't do that but I
wonder about it being cost effective.
The cost of purchasing and marinising two late model 4cyl TD's may not
be a hell of a lot cheaper than buying engines made for the job.
Have you shopped around for engine prices?
It may be possible to reuse your existing heat exchangers etc and if you
can do that then it may be cheaper to use car/truck engines.



Daryl
From: John McKenzie on 23 Feb 2007 01:56
jackbadger56 wrote:
>
> At some stage in the next few years we're going to have to re-power
> our boat as the twin SD33's are pretty tired. I was thinking (just
> thinking!) that fitting modern twin 4cyl turbo-diesels would be worth
> exploring. We've yet to get quotes on the Nissans but I'm sure it will
> cost a fortune simply because it's for a marine application (diesel
> fuel at all the marinas in Pittwater charge about $1.70 per litre, to
> give you an idea of what they can get away with). If we were to use a
> heat-exchanger set-up rather than pumping seawater through them, would
> you really need to do a great deal of modification for marine use? The
> 'engine room' (wow, that sounds grand!) is pretty well sealed and
> there is heaps of room, so maybe any computers etc can be located well
> out of harms way. Two of the marine mechanics I've put this to seem to
> think it should be OK in theory, but had never put any thought into
> it, as they had never been asked. They weren't keen on the idea
> basically, but couldn't really give me a reason why. Has anyone here
> had experience in fitting stock car engines into boats? If so, do you
> think this is feasible?
>
> BTW I've looked for an 'Aus.Boats' to ask this, but am also interested
> in what 'car-heads' think of this idea. Traditional boaties are just
> too blinded by......well........tradition, and would be horrified at the
> thought of doing this to a 60yo Halvorsen (despite the fact that it
> currently has Nissan truck motors, which in turn replaced a pair of
> Holden sixes!)

If fuelling is the main issue, what sort of power are you in need of
(and what sort of rpm, or do you have propellor options? I've got to be
inclined to think that a pair of 'somethings' on lpg would have to run
cheaper. it's not too hard to rig up a trailer with the right fittings
so you can fill 2-4 tanks on it, then run it back and put them in the
boat, similar but on a larger scale than forklift tanks. I have nfi as
to the legality, but I'd be looking into it keenly. It's likely the
cheapest by double to run per km, of course the setup cost might not be
choice. Then again, you might get away with a pair of holdens again, or
something. Maybe a pair of older ford 6s, reasonable torque if not so
rev happy.


--
John McKenzie

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From: Blue Heeler on 23 Feb 2007 02:12
John McKenzie wrote:

fitting a car engine to a boat.

Used to be a time honoured tradition - lots of Austin/Morris engines
had "marinising" kits available, and Vauxhaul side valve engines were
sold (with a few mods dealt with below) for years after they were no
longer fitted to cars.

Likewise Mercury has had car sourced 6 and 8 cyl engines in it's
"inboard" powerpacks in the past.


What do you need?

Depending on the engine (how much alloy is in the cooling circuit)
decided whether you use a closed circuit fresh water cooling system
with some sort of intercoolign arrangement, or just pump raw seawater
through it (perfectly safe with cast iron engines with cast iron water
pumps).

Next you need to make arrangements for getting oil out, a standpipe one
the side of the sump out of which you can suck the engine oil will
suffice, otherwise you get to let it all go into the bilge.

Water cooled exhaust manifold, these keep your exhaust temps down, and
also provide a ready source of hot water for distribution to internal
services like galleys and heads.

Modified flywheels to adapt to standard clutches etc for gear boxes.

Modified carb as the engine may well see attitudes it was never
intended to see in a car.

Ignition - the traiditon way was to fit a magneto, but this is probably
no longer necessery given that other forms of electronic ignition are
now more reliable.


anythgn else anyone?



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