for the guys that are into recreational oil changing...
in [Technical]
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From: Elle on 1 Apr 2010 20:54 On Apr 1, 5:51 pm, "Bob Jones" <em...(a)me.not> wrote: > "Elle" <honda.lion...(a)gmail.com> wrote in message > On Mar 31, 6:33 pm, "Bob Jones" <em...(a)me.not> wrote: > > >> Severe conditions are defined as follows: > >> I believe they apply to most drivers in this country. Are you saying no? > > I am saying "no," though it is conjecture like everyone else's. Honda > > itself says the normal schedule "is fine for most drivers." > > I do not see this phrase in Honda's manual. > > > From my > > 2003 Civic's manual: > > The "normal" schedule is fine for most drivers, even if they > > occasionally drive in severe conditions. > > That's a big difference from just saying "is fine for most drivers." Pardon? The manual is pointing out that one must drive "most of the time" in the severe conditions listed to warrant following the severe schedule. Only occasionally driving in severe conditions warrants the normal schedule.
From: Bill Putney on 1 Apr 2010 20:59 Ed Pawlowski wrote: > > "C. E. White" <cewhite3(a)mindspring.com> wrote >> I can't remember anyone in my family ever trading in a car becasue the >> engine was worn out. It always sem to be other stuff that finally >> makes the car/truck undesirable. > > > I had two. Both were 1983, GM with the same 3.8 liter engine, one an > Olds Cutlass, the other a Buick Regal. Both died at about 120,000 and I > put rebuilt engines in both and the rebuilds lasted another 50,000 > miles. It was a crappy engine design and no amount of oil changing > would help them. The newer 3800 V-6 in my next Buick was running as good > as the day it came from the showroom after 15 years and almost 200k. At > 75000 I changed the plugs. At 85,000, the water pump. Those engines apparently aren't like the 3.1L and other GM engines that get coolant leaks in their intake gaskets. -- Bill Putney (To reply by e-mail, replace the last letter of the alphabet in my address with the letter 'x')
From: clare on 1 Apr 2010 22:30 On Thu, 1 Apr 2010 10:37:42 -0400, "C. E. White" <cewhite3(a)mindspring.com> wrote: > >"jim" <"sjedgingN0Sp"@m(a)mwt,net> wrote in message >news:A8GdndMKt4ay1y7WnZ2dnUVZ_iydnZ2d(a)bright.net... > >> The question is why are there so many zealots on the internet that >> feel >> it is their mission in life to convince other motorists that it is >> good >> to be driving around with black oil in their engines? What sort of >> belief system drives a person to go around trying to convert others >> to >> black engine oil? > >While eveyone should make their own decisions on this, I can think of >a few "reasonable" reasons why it is useful to at least let people >know 3000 mile oil changes are not usually beneficial: > >1) To counteract the constant din from compnies like Jiffy-Lube that >have brainwashed gnerations of people into thinking you must change >your oil every 3000 miles. > >2) To make people aware that cars and oils are much better than was >the case when their Fathers used to change their oil. > >3) Becasue some people are concerned about the environement and don't >like seeing all that perfectly good oil being drained from engines. > >4) Just becasue we want people to know the facts so they can make an >informed decision. > >Ed > And those of us who prefer to change the oil more often are villified as liars and idiots by those who believe today's oils and engines are SO VASTLY improved, in ALL ways, over the e ngines and oils of the past. Yes, there have been major improvements - but the higher specific output and smaller bearing surfaces for reduced friction - and therefor better fuel mileage - and numerous other design changes, combined with the addition of Ethanol and other chemicals to the fuel and the mandated removal of Zinc based extreme pressure additives from the oil have ALL conspired to make the job of t he engine oil more severe.
From: clare on 1 Apr 2010 22:31 On Thu, 1 Apr 2010 11:18:13 -0500, "hls" <hls(a)nospam.nix> wrote: > >"C. E. White" <cewhite3(a)mindspring.com> wrote in message >> >> While eveyone should make their own decisions on this, I can think of a >> few "reasonable" reasons why it is useful to at least let people know 3000 >> mile oil changes are not usually beneficial: >> >> 1) To counteract the constant din from compnies like Jiffy-Lube that have >> brainwashed gnerations of people into thinking you must change your oil >> every 3000 miles. >> >> 2) To make people aware that cars and oils are much better than was the >> case when their Fathers used to change their oil. >> >> 3) Becasue some people are concerned about the environement and don't like >> seeing all that perfectly good oil being drained from engines. >> >> 4) Just becasue we want people to know the facts so they can make an >> informed decision. >> >> Ed > >What most people want, I think, is to have a car that goes when you turn >the key, and doesnt crater before you are ready to trade it in and get a >new one, all at a miraculously low price. > >We probably keep our cars longer than most people. 8-10 years for >us is not unusual. And I want minimum trouble. > I BUY mine about then. (well, the last few have been 6 years old) and generally SELL them at about 18. >I use the oil change interval recommended by the maker, no matter what >an oil analysis might indicate. If I err, it tends to be on the side of >changing >sooner than later. > >But as you say, everyone must make that decision for himself. It's your >car, do what you want with it.
From: clare on 1 Apr 2010 22:34
On Thu, 1 Apr 2010 12:56:05 -0400, "C. E. White" <cewhite3(a)mindspring.com> wrote: > >"hls" <hls(a)nospam.nix> wrote in message >news:R6qdnc3GYKDUWinWnZ2dnUVZ_o2dnZ2d(a)giganews.com... >> >> "C. E. White" <cewhite3(a)mindspring.com> wrote in message >>> >>> While eveyone should make their own decisions on this, I can think >>> of a few "reasonable" reasons why it is useful to at least let >>> people know 3000 mile oil changes are not usually beneficial: >>> >>> 1) To counteract the constant din from compnies like Jiffy-Lube >>> that have brainwashed gnerations of people into thinking you must >>> change your oil every 3000 miles. >>> >>> 2) To make people aware that cars and oils are much better than was >>> the case when their Fathers used to change their oil. >>> >>> 3) Becasue some people are concerned about the environement and >>> don't like seeing all that perfectly good oil being drained from >>> engines. >>> >>> 4) Just becasue we want people to know the facts so they can make >>> an informed decision. >>> >>> Ed >> >> What most people want, I think, is to have a car that goes when you >> turn >> the key, and doesnt crater before you are ready to trade it in and >> get a >> new one, all at a miraculously low price. > >I can't remember anyone in my family ever trading in a car becasue the >engine was worn out. It always sem to be other stuff that finally >makes the car/truck undesirable. > >> We probably keep our cars longer than most people. 8-10 years for >> us is not unusual. And I want minimum trouble. > >I tend to get tired of vehicles sooner than that, although there are >exceptions. But on the farm I usually keep things forever. My oldest >tractor is 30 years old and still on the original engine. I change the >oil in it every 150 engine hours or so. I figure this is roughly >comparable to 5000 mile oil changes, although the usage is more severe >than what you would see in a car. > And it also holds SUBSTANTIALLY more oil - and it is also a Diesel? >> I use the oil change interval recommended by the maker, no matter >> what >> an oil analysis might indicate. If I err, it tends to be on the >> side of changing >> sooner than later. > >When I had a Saturn with the oil life monitor, I was concnerned that I >wasn't changing the oil often enough. I am not sure I ever actually >waited until the light come on to change the oil. However one time >when the oil had over 7500 miles of use, I decided to send a sample >off to be analysed (I used Blackstone Labs). The analysis showed the >oil still qualified as a 5W30 oil with minimal contamination. The >report indicated that it was good until at least 10,000 miles. Of >course I had already changed it at that point. At other times I pulled >samples from other vehicles I own (or the SO owns) including a Nissan >Frontier, a Ford Fusion, a Ford Expedition, and a Toyota RAV4. All had >around 5000 miles on the oil at the time I pulled the samples for >analysis. In every case the analysis claimed the oil was still good >for many more miles. > >Changing oil at 3000 mile intervals is a hard habit for me to break. >However, I have the perfect test case in my family - my older sister. >Until she got cars with oil change indicators, she never remembered to >change her oil at all and I had to constantly remind her. Before the >oil change indicators, she would often exceed 10,000 miles on a >change. With her newer cars, she never changed the oil befor ethe >reminders, so her last Honda never got oil changes sooner than every >7500 miles. When she got rid of it last year, it had over 150,000 >miles on the odometer. The car was a POS, but the engine started >perfectly and ran fine. I can't see how changing the oil more oftne >could have benefited her. So, with her new Toyota, I feel she is in >fine shape. It has a reminder that comes on every 5000 miles. > >People always blame 3000 mile oil changes on the wisdom of their >Fathers and/or mechanics. My Father always complianed that I changed >oil too often (and on the farm changing tractors can get expensive). >He thought 5000 miles was soon enough. My favorite mechanic agrees, >5000 miles is plenty soon, and he has a financial interest in >encouraging more often changes. One of my neighbors uses synthetic oil >in his Silverado HD diesel. He changes the filter every 5000 miles, >but only changes the oil every 10,000 miles. The truck has nearly >100,000 miles and likely will be beat into a pile of junk before the >engine give up (he uses it to pull trailers frequently). > >Ed > |