for the guys that are into recreational oil changing...
in [Technical]
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From: dr_jeff on 2 Apr 2010 08:44 clare(a)snyder.on.ca wrote: > On Thu, 1 Apr 2010 10:37:42 -0400, "C. E. White" > <cewhite3(a)mindspring.com> wrote: > >> "jim" <"sjedgingN0Sp"@m(a)mwt,net> wrote in message >> news:A8GdndMKt4ay1y7WnZ2dnUVZ_iydnZ2d(a)bright.net... >> >>> The question is why are there so many zealots on the internet that >>> feel >>> it is their mission in life to convince other motorists that it is >>> good >>> to be driving around with black oil in their engines? What sort of >>> belief system drives a person to go around trying to convert others >>> to >>> black engine oil? >> While eveyone should make their own decisions on this, I can think of >> a few "reasonable" reasons why it is useful to at least let people >> know 3000 mile oil changes are not usually beneficial: >> >> 1) To counteract the constant din from compnies like Jiffy-Lube that >> have brainwashed gnerations of people into thinking you must change >> your oil every 3000 miles. >> >> 2) To make people aware that cars and oils are much better than was >> the case when their Fathers used to change their oil. >> >> 3) Becasue some people are concerned about the environement and don't >> like seeing all that perfectly good oil being drained from engines. >> >> 4) Just becasue we want people to know the facts so they can make an >> informed decision. >> >> Ed >> > > And those of us who prefer to change the oil more often are villified > as liars and idiots by those who believe today's oils and engines are > SO VASTLY improved, in ALL ways, over the e ngines and oils of the > past. > > Yes, there have been major improvements - but the higher specific > output and smaller bearing surfaces for reduced friction - and > therefor better fuel mileage - and numerous other design changes, > combined with the addition of Ethanol and other chemicals to the fuel > and the mandated removal of Zinc based extreme pressure > additives from the oil have ALL conspired to make the job of t he > engine oil more severe. Lighter cars and more efficient transmissions and accessories have made the job of the engine less severe.
From: Obveeus on 2 Apr 2010 08:44 "Tony Harding" <tharding(a)newsguy.com> wrote: > On 03/31/10 15:40, Obveeus wrote: >> "Elle"<honda.lioness(a)gmail.com> wrote in message >>> -- I would have to see a citation to believe that most people drive in >>> severe conditions. I think Jim B is right that "normal" is a word that >>> Honda chose for its manuals with careful consideration. >> >> I have seen 'severe conditions' described as 'lots of stop and go >> traffic'. >> If that is the definition, then yes, most people drive under severe >> conditions. > > Not to me, I take 'lots of stop and go traffic' to be like driving a cab > in NYC. I have never driven a car like that and don't know anyone who has. I would think that anyone living in a major city with a 45+ minute style commute qualifies...and yes, that is a significant number of drivers. Of course, 'lots of stop and go' is open to interpretation and maybe the manufacturers intends for it to mean only cars that are driven for 8+ hours per day under those conditions...but should the end user assume that is what they meant or err on the side of caution if they have a daily rush-hour commute? >I'm also curious which latitudes one has to live in to drive consistently > >90F or below freezing. I never pull a trailer nor do I ever go off road. Phoenix, Las Vegas, Los Angeles...millions of drivers deal with that 90+ temperature for months at a time. Entire states like Wyoming and Wisconsin deal with temperatures 'consistently' below freezing for months at a time.
From: dr_jeff on 2 Apr 2010 09:08 Obveeus wrote: > "Tony Harding" <tharding(a)newsguy.com> wrote: > >> On 03/31/10 15:40, Obveeus wrote: >>> "Elle"<honda.lioness(a)gmail.com> wrote in message >>>> -- I would have to see a citation to believe that most people drive in >>>> severe conditions. I think Jim B is right that "normal" is a word that >>>> Honda chose for its manuals with careful consideration. >>> I have seen 'severe conditions' described as 'lots of stop and go >>> traffic'. >>> If that is the definition, then yes, most people drive under severe >>> conditions. >> Not to me, I take 'lots of stop and go traffic' to be like driving a cab >> in NYC. I have never driven a car like that and don't know anyone who has. > > I would think that anyone living in a major city with a 45+ minute style > commute qualifies...and yes, that is a significant number of drivers. Of > course, 'lots of stop and go' is open to interpretation and maybe the > manufacturers intends for it to mean only cars that are driven for 8+ hours > per day under those conditions...but should the end user assume that is what > they meant or err on the side of caution if they have a daily rush-hour > commute? I used to have a 65-70 min commute. However, it didn't affect my mileage. I took the train. ;-) You can have 70 min commute, if you live far away, with mainly fast moving highways, even into NYC (I knew one teacher with about a 75-min commute from PA right into Harlem). >> I'm also curious which latitudes one has to live in to drive consistently > >> 90F or below freezing. I never pull a trailer nor do I ever go off road. > > Phoenix, Las Vegas, Los Angeles...millions of drivers deal with that 90+ > temperature for months at a time. > Entire states like Wyoming and Wisconsin deal with temperatures > 'consistently' below freezing for months at a time.
From: pws on 2 Apr 2010 09:17 Obveeus wrote: > "Tony Harding" <tharding(a)newsguy.com> wrote: > >> On 03/31/10 15:40, Obveeus wrote: >>> "Elle"<honda.lioness(a)gmail.com> wrote in message >>>> -- I would have to see a citation to believe that most people drive in >>>> severe conditions. I think Jim B is right that "normal" is a word that >>>> Honda chose for its manuals with careful consideration. >>> I have seen 'severe conditions' described as 'lots of stop and go >>> traffic'. >>> If that is the definition, then yes, most people drive under severe >>> conditions. >> Not to me, I take 'lots of stop and go traffic' to be like driving a cab >> in NYC. I have never driven a car like that and don't know anyone who has. > > I would think that anyone living in a major city with a 45+ minute style > commute qualifies...and yes, that is a significant number of drivers. Of > course, 'lots of stop and go' is open to interpretation and maybe the > manufacturers intends for it to mean only cars that are driven for 8+ hours > per day under those conditions...but should the end user assume that is what > they meant or err on the side of caution if they have a daily rush-hour > commute? > >> I'm also curious which latitudes one has to live in to drive consistently > >> 90F or below freezing. I never pull a trailer nor do I ever go off road. > > Phoenix, Las Vegas, Los Angeles...millions of drivers deal with that 90+ > temperature for months at a time. > Entire states like Wyoming and Wisconsin deal with temperatures > 'consistently' below freezing for months at a time. Dallas, Ft. Worth, Houston, El Paso, San Antonio & Austin. Many millions of Texans driving in the heat. It wasn't long ago that we went over 30 days in a row without getting below 100 during the day and never getting below 80 at night. The car I was driving at the time has no A/C. That was tough. I will never state how often I change my oil, that is now strictly classified information. ;-) Pat
From: Bill Putney on 2 Apr 2010 09:18
clare(a)snyder.on.ca wrote: > I also see a lot of cars blowing blue smoke - ring or valve-guide > failure CAN be oil related failures... On that same 2.7, it's not the valve guides per-se - it's the valve stem seals that get hard and brittle typically at 105 to 125k miles. I replaced mine along with timing chain, water pump, and oil pump (they increased the capacity of the oil pump a year or so after mine was built) at 207k miles - didn't touch the heads other than the stem seals. No more smoke, no more oil usage (until probably 350k miles. The valve and springs are recessed down into the head, and the selas can't take the heat (even though they are viton). Not really an oil related failure, but sludge certainly would be. -- Bill Putney (To reply by e-mail, replace the last letter of the alphabet in my address with the letter 'x') |