From: "Nightjar "cpb" on
Jo wrote:
> Hello all,
> I'm quite shaken as I had a brush with the grim reaper today :(
> Coming off a roundabout, I was driving along an A-road immediately
> behind a horse carriage doing 20 mph in a 60 mph road. I was about 150
> yards past the roundabout and a queue of cars had built up behind me.
> I felt pressured into overtaking the horse carriage. It was too slow
> for 3rd gear and I was in 2nd gear. The horse carriage seemed to speed
> up as I was overtaking them (but can't be sure). I sped up to about
> 30mph and was now astride the rear wheels of the vehicle. I fumbled
> the 2-3rd gear change (seemed stuck and cost me a few seconds to try
> again) and oncoming traffic lead by a truck was now too close. There
> was enough space if I didn't fumble the 2-3rd gear change and didn't
> expect my spot behind the horse trailer to be closed up so quickly
> So having no choice I floored the accelerator to 60mph on 3rd gear.
> The oncoming traffic went to the left of their lane to make way for me
> and three vehicles were astride at one point.
> If you were in that situation what would you have done? I couldn't
> have gone back and it seems the only way was to get past and in front
> of the horse trailer.
> Thanks for any advice. Please don't flame me I'm a new driver and my
> confidence has been badly shaken today already :(
> Jo

You made the common error of not building up a speed differential before
pulling out. That results in you having to accelerate to a passing speed
while on the opposite side of the road and, from what you say, probably
in a car without much spare power.

Had you dropped well back before starting to overtake, you could have
started your acceleration in your own lane. By the time you needed to
decide whether to brake back down to the speed of the vehicle in front
or continue with the overtaking manouvre, you could easily have been
doing 10-20mph more than it. At 20mph faster and accelerating, you would
only need to be on the wrong side of the road for a few seconds. You
would also not have been on the wrong side of the road when you made the
gear change.

Colin Bignell
From: Cynic on
On Tue, 20 Jul 2010 18:18:16 +0100, "Brimstone"
<brimstone(a)> wrote:

> is a single track road.

For interest, at the time I first lived in Rhodesia there were
thousands of miles of strip road like this:

When an oncoming car approaches, both vehicles move over to the left
so that their right wheel is on the left tarmac strip and their left
wheel is on the dirt. If a faster vehicle comes up from behind, you
similarly pull over to the left to allow it to pass.

The image is of a good quality road - there were many stretches where
the dirt in between and on either side of the tarmac strips were
significantly eroded, and you had to select the place to drive off the
strips with care.


From: Alex Heney on
On Mon, 19 Jul 2010 19:43:02 -0400, Dave Head <rally2xs(a)>

>On Mon, 19 Jul 2010 21:51:35 +0100, Alex Heney <me8(a)>

>>I'm not talking about situations where somebody is approaching fast, I
>>am talking about situations where a queue of traffic has formed, but
>>then they pull out to overtake in a place where it wouldn't be safe
>>for me - either because they are stupid, or because they have a car
>>powerful enough that it is safe for them to overtake two of us when it
>>wouldn't be safe for me to overtake one.
>Don't see any problem. If they are pulling out to pass in a place
>where it isn't safe for me to pass, I'm not going to be pulling out
>anyway, so there's no conflict, and will be no accident, unless the
>other car screws up the pass. That of course is always a possiblity,
>for which there is little defense.
>>But if it is in a place where I think it *is* safe, and I pull out to
>>overtake, they may be trying the same thing if I haven't indicated.
>Like I said, look in your rearviews before pulling out. If someone is
>approaching you fast from the rear, don't try to pass. If they
>aren't, then there's not a problem, is there?

Perhaps you could do me the courtesy of actually *reading* what you
are responding to?

I have already said, I am NOT talking about that situation.

That is an entirely different situation, and is one where you just
don't pull out.

>>>>If I had been pulling out to overate without warning, that would have
>>>>resulted in my trying 6to occupy the same piece of road as them. Which
>>>>doesn't work.
>>>It would have been entirely your fault for failing to maintain
>>>situational awareness.
>>One day, you should learn a little about *safe* driving.
>Been driving since 1963 - haven't run into anything yet...
>>Everything you have said so far indicates that you are a danger on the
>Yeah, this is typical usenet driving talk. Everybody thinks they're
>the only one that can drive.
>>The above would only be my fault AT ALL for not indicating.
>Woulda been your fault for starting a pass when someone was coming up
>fast from behind, and THAT will cause the accident, not the lack of a
>flashy light...

It would NOT have been my fault, because that i NOT the situation I am
talking about.

>>>>If I am going to overtake, and there is somebody behind me, I
>>>>indicate, to make sure that doesn't happen.
>>>You go right ahead. I watch what is going on in order to do the same
>>If everybody drove like you, then you wouldn't have a clue what would
>>be going on, because nobody would be giving any indication.
>>>You're flaw is that you expect them not to attempt to overtake
>>>simply 'cuz you make some little light flash. Ha! I don't trust 'em
>>>that far. I'm going to do things for myself. I trust me a whale of a
>>>lot more than I trust them.
>>I don't "trust" them not to try it.
>>I do trust them to at least be aware enough not to ram me in that
>Flaw. You have to look, see the way is clear even from behind, and
>then attempt whatever you're going to attempt only when the way is
>SUPPOSED TO. Doing so increases the risk of making you dead.

Shouting doesn't make it any more sensible to make the point I have
already agreed with,.

>> And if they are unaware enough to do so, then I know it
>>would be all their fault.
>I don't give a rip about "fault." I only care whether there is a
>collision. I've been doing what I've been doing for a long time, and
>not giving the bastards a chance to wreck me has worked every time.
>>Hopefully with no more than damage to
>>vehicles to show for their error.
>I don't tolerate damage. I'm just not gonna let it happen.

If you have a very powerful car, then you can be sure nobody *can* do
that to you.

I don't,. I have a normal family estate car.
Alex Heney, Global Villager
*Four hours* to bury a cat? Yes - it wouldn't keep still
To reply by email, my address is alexATheneyDOTplusDOTcom
From: Dave Head on
On Tue, 20 Jul 2010 21:01:47 +0100, Alex Heney <me8(a)>
>If you have a very powerful car, then you can be sure nobody *can* do
>that to you.
>I don't,. I have a normal family estate car.

Who's fault is that?
From: Steve Firth on
Alex Heney <me8(a)> wrote:

> there is little that is more moronic than

.... Your posts.