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From: GT on 20 May 2010 14:53 "John" <Who90nospam(a)ntlworld.com> wrote in message news:1jfJn.205349$IA1.153162(a)newsfe06.ams2... > > "GT" <a(a)b.c> wrote in message > news:4bf55e2f$0$24677$c3e8da3(a)news.astraweb.com... >> "Brimstone" <brimstone(a)hotmail.com> wrote in message >> news:Y_WdnZyOILNUzWjWnZ2dnUVZ8vGdnZ2d(a)bt.com... >>> It seems that in order to make so called "green" equipment, like >>> electric bikes and cars, it's necessary to use ever more of the planet's >>> dwindling resources which themselves rapidly diminishing. >>> >>> http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/sci/tech/8689547.stm >> >> Saying 'so called' is absolutely spot on. Far more energy is used up >> building these new battery cars than will ever be used in an existing >> diesel or petrol car's lifetime. The only reason to buy an electric car >> is if you are in the market for a new car anyway and don't plan on >> driving any long journeys, as their range is very poor! > > Too many people - too many now wanting consumer goods and cars: > > http://www.optimumpopulation.org/ What has that got to do with the discussion in hand - that of the debate over cars that burn hydrocarbons internally and efficiently versus cars that burn hydrocarbons remotely and less efficiently?
From: Brimstone on 20 May 2010 14:57 "GT" <a(a)b.c> wrote in message news:4bf58510$0$24712$c3e8da3(a)news.astraweb.com... > "John" <Who90nospam(a)ntlworld.com> wrote in message > news:1jfJn.205349$IA1.153162(a)newsfe06.ams2... >> >> "GT" <a(a)b.c> wrote in message >> news:4bf55e2f$0$24677$c3e8da3(a)news.astraweb.com... >>> "Brimstone" <brimstone(a)hotmail.com> wrote in message >>> news:Y_WdnZyOILNUzWjWnZ2dnUVZ8vGdnZ2d(a)bt.com... >>>> It seems that in order to make so called "green" equipment, like >>>> electric bikes and cars, it's necessary to use ever more of the >>>> planet's dwindling resources which themselves rapidly diminishing. >>>> >>>> http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/sci/tech/8689547.stm >>> >>> Saying 'so called' is absolutely spot on. Far more energy is used up >>> building these new battery cars than will ever be used in an existing >>> diesel or petrol car's lifetime. The only reason to buy an electric car >>> is if you are in the market for a new car anyway and don't plan on >>> driving any long journeys, as their range is very poor! >> >> Too many people - too many now wanting consumer goods and cars: >> >> http://www.optimumpopulation.org/ > > What has that got to do with the discussion in hand - that of the debate > over cars that burn hydrocarbons internally and efficiently versus cars > that burn hydrocarbons remotely and less efficiently? Because if there were not so many people on the planet wanting the trappings of consumerism we wouldn't be using non-renewables as quickly as we are and there would be less pollution.
From: GT on 20 May 2010 15:11 "Brimstone" <brimstone(a)hotmail.com> wrote in message news:VP-dna0RR_SrG2jWnZ2dnUVZ7qqdnZ2d(a)bt.com... > "GT" <a(a)b.c> wrote in message > news:4bf58510$0$24712$c3e8da3(a)news.astraweb.com... >> "John" <Who90nospam(a)ntlworld.com> wrote in message >> news:1jfJn.205349$IA1.153162(a)newsfe06.ams2... >>> >>> "GT" <a(a)b.c> wrote in message >>> news:4bf55e2f$0$24677$c3e8da3(a)news.astraweb.com... >>>> "Brimstone" <brimstone(a)hotmail.com> wrote in message >>>> news:Y_WdnZyOILNUzWjWnZ2dnUVZ8vGdnZ2d(a)bt.com... >>>>> It seems that in order to make so called "green" equipment, like >>>>> electric bikes and cars, it's necessary to use ever more of the >>>>> planet's dwindling resources which themselves rapidly diminishing. >>>>> >>>>> http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/sci/tech/8689547.stm >>>> >>>> Saying 'so called' is absolutely spot on. Far more energy is used up >>>> building these new battery cars than will ever be used in an existing >>>> diesel or petrol car's lifetime. The only reason to buy an electric car >>>> is if you are in the market for a new car anyway and don't plan on >>>> driving any long journeys, as their range is very poor! >>> >>> Too many people - too many now wanting consumer goods and cars: >>> >>> http://www.optimumpopulation.org/ >> >> What has that got to do with the discussion in hand - that of the debate >> over cars that burn hydrocarbons internally and efficiently versus cars >> that burn hydrocarbons remotely and less efficiently? > > Because if there were not so many people on the planet wanting the > trappings of consumerism we wouldn't be using non-renewables as quickly as > we are and there would be less pollution. OK then, I'll bite the subject change. Industry makes things, comerce sells them. When resources get scarce, the price goes up and people find alternative things to buy. This does not just apply to cars, its just that the automotive industry is enourmous and widely publicised. If cars and their parts start to get scarce, then perhaps people will consider keeping cars for longer and maintaining them. I have never been in favour of the modern throw-away society. This would greatly reduce the number of new cars required and thereby reduce the environmental, which should please the 'green' people.
From: Brimstone on 20 May 2010 15:38 "GT" <a(a)b.c> wrote in message news:4bf58971$0$24675$c3e8da3(a)news.astraweb.com... > "Brimstone" <brimstone(a)hotmail.com> wrote in message > news:VP-dna0RR_SrG2jWnZ2dnUVZ7qqdnZ2d(a)bt.com... >> "GT" <a(a)b.c> wrote in message >> news:4bf58510$0$24712$c3e8da3(a)news.astraweb.com... >>> "John" <Who90nospam(a)ntlworld.com> wrote in message >>> news:1jfJn.205349$IA1.153162(a)newsfe06.ams2... >>>> >>>> "GT" <a(a)b.c> wrote in message >>>> news:4bf55e2f$0$24677$c3e8da3(a)news.astraweb.com... >>>>> "Brimstone" <brimstone(a)hotmail.com> wrote in message >>>>> news:Y_WdnZyOILNUzWjWnZ2dnUVZ8vGdnZ2d(a)bt.com... >>>>>> It seems that in order to make so called "green" equipment, like >>>>>> electric bikes and cars, it's necessary to use ever more of the >>>>>> planet's dwindling resources which themselves rapidly diminishing. >>>>>> >>>>>> http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/sci/tech/8689547.stm >>>>> >>>>> Saying 'so called' is absolutely spot on. Far more energy is used up >>>>> building these new battery cars than will ever be used in an existing >>>>> diesel or petrol car's lifetime. The only reason to buy an electric >>>>> car is if you are in the market for a new car anyway and don't plan on >>>>> driving any long journeys, as their range is very poor! >>>> >>>> Too many people - too many now wanting consumer goods and cars: >>>> >>>> http://www.optimumpopulation.org/ >>> >>> What has that got to do with the discussion in hand - that of the debate >>> over cars that burn hydrocarbons internally and efficiently versus cars >>> that burn hydrocarbons remotely and less efficiently? >> >> Because if there were not so many people on the planet wanting the >> trappings of consumerism we wouldn't be using non-renewables as quickly >> as we are and there would be less pollution. > > OK then, I'll bite the subject change. There is no subject change, my OP did not specify the items being made, it was much more generalist. > Industry makes things, comerce sells them. When resources get scarce, the > price goes up and people find alternative things to buy. This does not > just apply to cars, its just that the automotive industry is enourmous and > widely publicised. If cars and their parts start to get scarce, then > perhaps people will consider keeping cars for longer and maintaining them. > I have never been in favour of the modern throw-away society. This would > greatly reduce the number of new cars required and thereby reduce the > environmental, which should please the 'green' people. Indeed.
From: Man at B&Q on 21 May 2010 03:36
On May 20, 4:25 pm, Clive George <cl...(a)xxxx-x.fsnet.co.uk> wrote: > On 20/05/2010 16:09, Brimstone wrote: > > > It seems that in order to make so called "green" equipment, like > > electric bikes and cars, it's necessary to use ever more of the planet's > > dwindling resources which themselves rapidly diminishing. > > >http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/sci/tech/8689547.stm > > > So with petroleum running out and the materials needed to create more > > efficient electric devices also running out, almost before we've started > > it looks as if we're screwed. > > "Most came form the United States in the 1960s but tightening > environmental regulations and a price war closed the last Californian > mine, handing China a virtual monopoly." > > If demand is sufficient, prices will rise and that mine will become > economic again. Which is the very reason oil will not run out in our lifetime. There's plenty left, just not recoverable in todays market. MBQ |