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From: Michael Coburn on 27 Jul 2010 00:21 On Mon, 26 Jul 2010 21:59:20 -0400, Dave Head wrote: > On 27 Jul 2010 01:28:59 GMT, Michael Coburn <mikcob(a)verizon.net> wrote: > >>On Mon, 26 Jul 2010 15:22:47 -0700, Larry G wrote: >> >>> On Jul 25, 9:27 pm, Dave Head <rally...(a)att.net> wrote: >>>> On Sun, 25 Jul 2010 20:13:26 -0500, "bugo" <wat...(a)yahoo.com> wrote: >>>> >"Dave Head" <rally...(a)att.net> wrote in message >>>> >news:bhnp46teki6ftfe9lco9p88sg7a567u28m(a)4ax.com... >>>> >> The Fair Tax is applied as a sales tax on new items and services >>>> >> sold at retail. Things sold at wholesale, or for use in commerce, >>>> >> are not taxed. So, Farmer Brown's seed stock for the year is not >>>> >> taxed, nor is his tractor. The corn you buy from him is taxed >>>> >> since it is sold to you at retail. Every new item and every >>>> >> service, save one, is taxed. The only service not taxed is >>>> >> tuition. >>>> >>>> >So corporations get off scot-free. >>>> >>>> They always have. No corporation has ever paid a penny of tax. >>>> They've just passed that expense along to the rest of us who buy >>>> their products, and we pay it. THe corporation simply ends up being >>>> a tax collector, to the detriment of Ameican industrial >>>> competitiveness. >>>> >>>> >No wonder why you corporate-loving Repubs like it so much. >>>> >>>> Why would you not be "corporate-loving." Where else do you think >>>> you're going to get the good jobs to raise people out of poverty? >>>> >>>> >In your distorted world, corporations can do no wrong. >>>> >>>> Didn't say that, but that's no reason to hate them all because some >>>> of them do really nasty stuff. >>> >>> corps just pass on the taxes to the customers... that's true. >> >>Nope. > > Absolutely. The customer is the only source of money a corporation has. > Its the only place that the tax money can come from. BAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHA!!!!!!!!!!!! What matters is WHO suffers the "burden of the tax". Not where money comes from in the normal course of events: The XYZ corporation (that makes Slinkys) pays $1.00/share in dividends to all share holders each year. Then there is a new tax on the XYZ corporation or one of its suppliers that CAN PASS the TAX to XYZ. What will happen is that if the XYZ corporation attempts to raise the price of Slinkys then the people will buy hula hoops instead (or maybe they will decide to make stuff on their own). Hence, the XYZ corporation can't increase the tax so as to "pass" it to the consumer. This actually follows from the _FACT_ that all entities are profit maximizing. If XYZ could have raised the price, they would already have done so. They would not be sitting around waiting on an excuse. What _WILL_ happen in this market is that the stockholders will receive less in dividends. Effectvely, the stockholders were taxed. Not the customers. In the real world it is a SPLIT (all else equal). But we still can't determine where the burden actually falls until we know what was done with the proceeds. > If you didn't pay it from revenues from sales, then you'd have to pay it > by lowering worker salaries, failing to pay dividends, etc. That'd harm > the company, and it'd probably, eventually, go out of business. NO... It will not be "go out of business". The shareholders will receive _LESS_ than they otherwise would have and the price of the stock will probably fall. That does not mean "out of business". It means that the non-productive segment of the economy will get LESS for doing the same NOTHING that they were doing before. -- "Senate rules don't trump the Constitution" -- http://GreaterVoice.org/60
From: Beam Me Up Scotty on 27 Jul 2010 00:11 On 7/27/2010 12:21 AM, Michael Coburn wrote: > On Mon, 26 Jul 2010 21:59:20 -0400, Dave Head wrote: > >> On 27 Jul 2010 01:28:59 GMT, Michael Coburn <mikcob(a)verizon.net> wrote: >> >>> On Mon, 26 Jul 2010 15:22:47 -0700, Larry G wrote: >>> >>>> On Jul 25, 9:27 pm, Dave Head <rally...(a)att.net> wrote: >>>>> On Sun, 25 Jul 2010 20:13:26 -0500, "bugo" <wat...(a)yahoo.com> wrote: >>>>>> "Dave Head" <rally...(a)att.net> wrote in message >>>>>> news:bhnp46teki6ftfe9lco9p88sg7a567u28m(a)4ax.com... >>>>>>> The Fair Tax is applied as a sales tax on new items and services >>>>>>> sold at retail. Things sold at wholesale, or for use in commerce, >>>>>>> are not taxed. So, Farmer Brown's seed stock for the year is not >>>>>>> taxed, nor is his tractor. The corn you buy from him is taxed >>>>>>> since it is sold to you at retail. Every new item and every >>>>>>> service, save one, is taxed. The only service not taxed is >>>>>>> tuition. >>>>> >>>>>> So corporations get off scot-free. >>>>> >>>>> They always have. No corporation has ever paid a penny of tax. >>>>> They've just passed that expense along to the rest of us who buy >>>>> their products, and we pay it. THe corporation simply ends up being >>>>> a tax collector, to the detriment of Ameican industrial >>>>> competitiveness. >>>>> >>>>>> No wonder why you corporate-loving Repubs like it so much. >>>>> >>>>> Why would you not be "corporate-loving." Where else do you think >>>>> you're going to get the good jobs to raise people out of poverty? >>>>> >>>>>> In your distorted world, corporations can do no wrong. >>>>> >>>>> Didn't say that, but that's no reason to hate them all because some >>>>> of them do really nasty stuff. >>>> >>>> corps just pass on the taxes to the customers... that's true. >>> >>> Nope. >> >> Absolutely. The customer is the only source of money a corporation has. >> Its the only place that the tax money can come from. > > BAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHA!!!!!!!!!!!! > > What matters is WHO suffers the "burden of the tax". Not where money > comes from in the normal course of events: The customer suffers the burden as he pays the cost of the new toaster that is $1.00 more than it should have been. The business/corporation owners will get the 8% return on their investment or they cut cost or raise price or sell the business or sell their stock.... they don't just lay down with their legs open for the government to f*ck them. Why would I buy stock in a company that pays no dividend because they can't make any money? I need a return on my investment to make the risk worth it.
From: Matthew Russotto on 27 Jul 2010 00:13 In article <i2lhgh$bmu$1(a)news.eternal-september.org>, bugo <watuzi(a)yahoo.com> wrote: > > > > >"Matthew Russotto" <russotto(a)grace.speakeasy.net> wrote in message >news:Yzq3o.31783$4B7.24442(a)newsfe16.iad... >> In article <i2lbjo$o66$1(a)news.eternal-september.org>, >> bugo <watuzi(a)yahoo.com> wrote: >>> >>> >>> >>> >>>"Matthew Russotto" <russotto(a)grace.speakeasy.net> wrote in message >>>news:Jiq3o.31778$4B7.23603(a)newsfe16.iad... >>>> In article <i2irg8$71v$1(a)news.eternal-september.org>, >>>> bugo <watuzi(a)yahoo.com> wrote: >>>>> >>>>> >>>>>What's the difference? They refuse to pay for health care, which is the >>>>>same thing as murder as far as I'm concerned. >>>> >>>> Then you're an idiot. >>> >>>Why am I an idiot? Elaborate. >> >> Because you claim that refusing to pay for health care is the same >> thing as murder. That's an idiotic statement. > >What's the difference? If you're dead, you're dead. It's at least >manslaughter. Even with that backpedal, you're still an idiot. -- The problem with socialism is there's always someone with less ability and more need.
From: Michael Coburn on 27 Jul 2010 00:51 On Mon, 26 Jul 2010 23:53:39 -0400, Beam Me Up Scotty wrote: > On 7/26/2010 9:28 PM, Michael Coburn wrote: >> On Mon, 26 Jul 2010 15:22:47 -0700, Larry G wrote: >> >>> On Jul 25, 9:27 pm, Dave Head <rally...(a)att.net> wrote: >>>> On Sun, 25 Jul 2010 20:13:26 -0500, "bugo" <wat...(a)yahoo.com> wrote: >>>>> "Dave Head" <rally...(a)att.net> wrote in message >>>>> news:bhnp46teki6ftfe9lco9p88sg7a567u28m(a)4ax.com... >>>>>> The Fair Tax is applied as a sales tax on new items and services >>>>>> sold at retail. Things sold at wholesale, or for use in commerce, >>>>>> are not taxed. So, Farmer Brown's seed stock for the year is not >>>>>> taxed, nor is his tractor. The corn you buy from him is taxed >>>>>> since it is sold to you at retail. Every new item and every >>>>>> service, save one, is taxed. The only service not taxed is >>>>>> tuition. >>>> >>>>> So corporations get off scot-free. >>>> >>>> They always have. No corporation has ever paid a penny of tax. >>>> They've just passed that expense along to the rest of us who buy >>>> their products, and we pay it. THe corporation simply ends up being >>>> a tax collector, to the detriment of Ameican industrial >>>> competitiveness. >>>> >>>>> No wonder why you corporate-loving Repubs like it so much. >>>> >>>> Why would you not be "corporate-loving." Where else do you think >>>> you're going to get the good jobs to raise people out of poverty? >>>> >>>>> In your distorted world, corporations can do no wrong. >>>> >>>> Didn't say that, but that's no reason to hate them all because some >>>> of them do really nasty stuff. >>> >>> corps just pass on the taxes to the customers... that's true. >> >> Nope. > > Explain what source the corporation's tax money comes from if it isn't > coming from the customer. The increased payments to the government are taken from what would have been paid out as dividends and/or the value of the stock takes a hit. IN either case, the corporation eats the tax and the customers pay the same amount as before for the same product or service. <<<<<<<<<<<<<<< FURTHER STUPIDITY DELETED >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> -- "Senate rules don't trump the Constitution" -- http://GreaterVoice.org/60
From: Michael Coburn on 27 Jul 2010 00:59
On Tue, 27 Jul 2010 00:11:30 -0400, Beam Me Up Scotty wrote: > On 7/27/2010 12:21 AM, Michael Coburn wrote: >> On Mon, 26 Jul 2010 21:59:20 -0400, Dave Head wrote: >> >>> On 27 Jul 2010 01:28:59 GMT, Michael Coburn <mikcob(a)verizon.net> >>> wrote: >>> >>>> On Mon, 26 Jul 2010 15:22:47 -0700, Larry G wrote: >>>> >>>>> On Jul 25, 9:27 pm, Dave Head <rally...(a)att.net> wrote: >>>>>> On Sun, 25 Jul 2010 20:13:26 -0500, "bugo" <wat...(a)yahoo.com> >>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>> "Dave Head" <rally...(a)att.net> wrote in message >>>>>>> news:bhnp46teki6ftfe9lco9p88sg7a567u28m(a)4ax.com... >>>>>>>> The Fair Tax is applied as a sales tax on new items and services >>>>>>>> sold at retail. Things sold at wholesale, or for use in >>>>>>>> commerce, are not taxed. So, Farmer Brown's seed stock for the >>>>>>>> year is not taxed, nor is his tractor. The corn you buy from him >>>>>>>> is taxed since it is sold to you at retail. Every new item and >>>>>>>> every service, save one, is taxed. The only service not taxed is >>>>>>>> tuition. >>>>>> >>>>>>> So corporations get off scot-free. >>>>>> >>>>>> They always have. No corporation has ever paid a penny of tax. >>>>>> They've just passed that expense along to the rest of us who buy >>>>>> their products, and we pay it. THe corporation simply ends up >>>>>> being a tax collector, to the detriment of Ameican industrial >>>>>> competitiveness. >>>>>> >>>>>>> No wonder why you corporate-loving Repubs like it so much. >>>>>> >>>>>> Why would you not be "corporate-loving." Where else do you think >>>>>> you're going to get the good jobs to raise people out of poverty? >>>>>> >>>>>>> In your distorted world, corporations can do no wrong. >>>>>> >>>>>> Didn't say that, but that's no reason to hate them all because some >>>>>> of them do really nasty stuff. >>>>> >>>>> corps just pass on the taxes to the customers... that's true. >>>> >>>> Nope. >>> >>> Absolutely. The customer is the only source of money a corporation >>> has. >>> Its the only place that the tax money can come from. >> >> BAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHA!!!!!!!!!!!! >> >> What matters is WHO suffers the "burden of the tax". Not where money >> comes from in the normal course of events: > > > The customer suffers the burden as he pays the cost of the new toaster > that is $1.00 more than it should have been. Nope. And I see that you now admit this below. > The business/corporation > owners will get the 8% return on their investment or they cut cost or > raise price or sell the business or sell their stock.... they don't > just lay down with their legs open for the government to f*ck them. So what??? The customer does not pay the all the tax and may not pay any of it. If the company could have gotten more for its toaster it would have already done so. The company can't raise the price or it will lose volume and revenue. It depends on the elasticity of demand. But you are too ignorant to understand such a concept. > Why would I buy stock in a company that pays no dividend because they > can't make any money? I need a return on my investment to make the risk > worth it. Why do you think I, or anyone else, cares whether or not you buy stock, or count sheep??? -- "Senate rules don't trump the Constitution" -- http://GreaterVoice.org/60 |