From: Tegger on 25 Feb 2010 17:54
"C. E. White" <cewhite3(a)mindspring.com> wrote in news:hm661q$p58$1
> "Tegger" <invalid(a)invalid.inv> wrote in message
>> Or it's simple pedal misapplication, which is the most common cause
>> of SUA
>> by far, and is essentially out of /any/ automaker's control.
> Not really - software that recognized both pedals are pressed could
> cut power to the engine.
Which Toyota is doing.
But that doesn't affect pedal misapplication if only ONE pedal is
depressed. That situation covers the overwhleming majority of SUA
> The shift interlocks that force you to press
> on the brakes before shifting into gear were a "fix" for the Audi 5000
> UA concerns. If the Safety Nazis get there way, there will be so many
> fixes for potential/theoretical driver errors, that cars won't be
> usable, or affordable.
And somebody, somewhere, will still find a way to make a car run away with
itself anyway. At some point you have to give SOME sort of control to the
driver. and ANY sort of control of ANY kind carries SOME degree of risk.
Life is dangerous. And it's imperfect. And it is risky. At some point you
have to accept those facts, be your own last line of defense, and stop
From: Hachiroku ハチロク on 25 Feb 2010 19:48
On Thu, 25 Feb 2010 16:20:52 +0000, Clive wrote:
> In message <QuidnRjN_4LnlRvWnZ2dnUVZ_gGdnZ2d(a)linkline.com>, Uncle_vito
> <uncle_vito2002(a)yahoo.com> writes
>>Made in Japan only applies to the accelerator fix. If it is a software
>>problem, all bets are off. Could be in cars no matter where made since
>>they do noit know the cause. How can they say which cars are not
> I live in England and I have had a recall for my car which was made in
> Nottingham England, I understand mot of the parts are locally sourced so
> that implies that the design is faulty.
I believe the accelerators for Europe were sourced from CTS as well.
From: Hachiroku ハチロク on 25 Feb 2010 19:50
On Thu, 25 Feb 2010 09:37:20 -0600, Steve wrote:
> jim beam wrote:
>> On 02/24/2010 09:19 PM, Uncle_vito wrote:
>>> Made in Japan only applies to the accelerator fix. If it is a
>>> software problem, all bets are off. Could be in cars no matter where
>>> made since they
>>> do noit know the cause. How can they say which cars are not affected?
>> dude, it it were a software problem, /all/ their vehicles would be
>> exhibiting the exact same problem all the time.
> So you believe that they use exactly the same software build in every
I don't get where he said that. A lot of people are pointing to the
electronics, but since the affliction spans a lot of models, electronics
seems out of the picture.
From: Hachiroku ハチロク on 25 Feb 2010 19:54
On Thu, 25 Feb 2010 10:37:24 -0500, C. E. White wrote:
>> Since your pedal was sourced from Japan, and not CTS in the US, it does
>> not have this problem.
> Are you sure this is true? I haven't been able to find a decent
> description of the Denso pedal assembly. Are you sure it is that much
> different? Got a link to pictures?
Interesting post. That's what I get for listening to NBC News.
No, I don't have any pix, but the Denso pedals don't seem to have the
>> But here's a hint: turn your cruise control OFF when you're not using
>> OFF, not just Cancel, or hitting the brakes. OFF.
> Since most current cruise controls (and by most I am including
> manufacturers other than Toyota) use soft switches (i.e., switches that
> send a signal, they don't actually disconnect the circuit), I doubt if
> this makes any difference. Both "cancel" and "off" just send a signal to
> the computer telling the computer to initiate a function. Off is just a
> different signal than cancel. In the old days "off" actually cut the power
> to the cruise control. Now for many autos, off only means, "don't pay
> attention to other cruice control inputs." Ford got tired of people
> blaming the cruise controls for UA, so they added the stupid brake line
> switch to physically cut power to the cruise control actuator when the
> brakes were pressed. And then this screwed up. Fix a bug, add a bug....
> I'd be tempted to go back to vaccum operated cruise controls!
They were inefficient, but when you went below ~30MPH, they lost their
'memory' and had to be reset to work .
From: bob on 25 Feb 2010 19:55
In article <Xns9D2AB50D8C0F4tegger(a)220.127.116.11>, invalid(a)invalid.inv
> "C. E. White" <cewhite3(a)mindspring.com> wrote in news:hm66bl$rnb$1
> > "jim beam" <me(a)privacy.net> wrote in message
> > news:ksWdnXsZp4N7GhvWnZ2dnUVZ_oqdnZ2d(a)speakeasy.net...
> >> double-standard bullshit. frod bribed the entire congress into
> >> accepting a lie about tires being at fault for a fundamentally
> >> flawed vehicle design. where the heck were all you guys then?
> > You have to quit repeating this lie. Explorers were no more
> > "fundamentally flawed" than other mid sized SUVs from the 1990's. As I
> > have pointed out to you multiple times, the accident rates, injury
> > rates, rollover rates, etc. for Explorers were actually better than
> > for most competitive vehciels and far better than for 4Runners from
> > that period. Explorers actually had much lower injury rates that
> > "Average" vehciles in that time period.
> The two vehicles are not really comparable. The Explorer and the 4Runner
> attracted different markets, with the 4Runner's market being younger.
> Younger is generally associated with higher accident claims.
> I've never driven an Explorer, but I did spend two weeks driving an Escape,
> a few years ago. I was quite impressed with the truck's handling. For such
> a tall vehicle, it was surprisingly nimble and well-controlled. Had I been
> in the market for a small domestic SUV, I think the Escape would have been
> my choice.
The Escape is not a truck-based SUV. It's chassis is a modified version
of the old Mazda 626 from when Ford had a large share in Mazda. It's
also used in the Mazda Tribute. They are both made on the same assembly
line, although very few parts are interchangeable.