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From: Mike G on 18 Jun 2008 18:17 "Eeyore" <rabbitsfriendsandrelations(a)hotmail.com> wrote in message news:48594CAA.71E5B685(a)hotmail.com... > > > Mike G wrote: > >> "Eeyore" wrote >> > Conor wrote: >> >> Mike G says... >> >> >> >> > There's a helluva difference between flying a single prop >> >> > light aircraft and something like a 747. With or without >> >> > autopilot. >> >> > Mike. >> >> > >> >> Basics are the same. >> > >> > So why is there a >> > >> > Multi Engine Rating ? >> > Instrument (instrument meterological conditions) Rating >> > (IMC) >> > Instrument (instrument flight rules) Rating (IFR) >> > Commercial Pilot's License >> > Air Tranport Pilot's Licence >> > Type Rating (on aircraft) >> > >> > And could you name the one single over-riding difference >> > between the use of >> > the rudder on any large passenger jet and your Cessna ? >> >> Seeing as Conor has failed to answer the question, Maybe you'd >> tell me. I know how a rudder is used on light aircraft. Tail >> dragger or tricycle especially during take-off or landing, but >> I >> can't see how it's use can be any different for large >> passenger >> jets. > > In a small private aircraft the rudder is used regularly in > turns for > example to avoid wing drop. One of the first lessons I learnt. That was down to your instructor. It's perfectly possible to make turns in a light aircraft without losing hight, just by use of the ailerons and elevator. Using the rudder makes a turn more elegant, as it can be used to keep the fuselage in line with the direction of flight. So it's desirable IMO but not necessary. Mike.
From: Eeyore on 18 Jun 2008 19:09 Raymond Keattch wrote: > On 18/06/2008 20:02:32, Eeyore wrote: > > > The pilots are there to 'tell' the computers what to do (i.e to actually > > fly the aircraft using the control interface like the control wheel / > > sidestick, throttles etc and lets the computers do the basic > > 'housekeeping' like ensuring all the temps and pressures are correct and > > keeping a specific course if so demanded) and take over if they break. > > I watched this video, and came to the conclusion that Conor must be on > something. > > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2frjSvo9BBc Oh yes. I know that one too. Am I a total aviation safety nerd ? Engine surge on #2. That's why the pilots are there. Graham
From: Eeyore on 18 Jun 2008 19:29 Mike G wrote: > "Eeyore" wrote > > Mike G wrote: > >> "Eeyore" wrote > >> > Conor wrote: > >> >> Mike G says... > >> >> > >> >> > There's a helluva difference between flying a single prop > >> >> > light aircraft and something like a 747. With or without > >> >> > autopilot. > >> >> > > >> >> Basics are the same. > >> > > >> > So why is there a > >> > > >> > Multi Engine Rating ? > >> > Instrument (instrument meterological conditions) Rating > >> > (IMC) > >> > Instrument (instrument flight rules) Rating (IFR) > >> > Commercial Pilot's License > >> > Air Tranport Pilot's Licence > >> > Type Rating (on aircraft) > >> > > >> > And could you name the one single over-riding difference > >> > between the use of > >> > the rudder on any large passenger jet and your Cessna ? > >> > >> Seeing as Conor has failed to answer the question, Maybe you'd > >> tell me. I know how a rudder is used on light aircraft. Tail > >> dragger or tricycle especially during take-off or landing, but > >> I can't see how it's use can be any different for large > >> passenger jets. > > > > In a small private aircraft the rudder is used regularly in > > turns for example to avoid wing drop. One of the first lessons I > learnt. > > That was down to your instructor. It's perfectly possible to make > turns in a light aircraft without losing hight, just by use of > the ailerons and elevator. Yeah but you'll lose energy. > Using the rudder makes a turn more elegant, Damn right. > as it can be used to keep the fuselage in line with the > direction of flight. So it's desirable IMO but not necessary. Hmmmm. it's good practice anyway. Esp for PPLs. But I was so seemingly 'over-confident' at the flight I had already conducted already I was pushing it ! Interesting thing ... I didn't actually panic at all although I could see I was losing altitude. The instructor hadn't expected me to make such an aggressive turn but being a real pro - he let me get into trouble before pulling me out and explaining why. Then he let me fly over my home city before going the other side and pulling some 2G aerobatics. I shall never forget Quentin. A damn nice chap and an excellent tutor. Graham
From: Mike G on 18 Jun 2008 21:03 "Eeyore" <rabbitsfriendsandrelations(a)hotmail.com> wrote in message news:48599A6D.71FE6E8C(a)hotmail.com... > > > Mike G wrote: > >> "Eeyore" wrote >> > Mike G wrote: >> >> "Eeyore" wrote >> >> > Conor wrote: >> >> >> Mike G says... >> >> >> >> >> >> > There's a helluva difference between flying a single >> >> >> > prop >> >> >> > light aircraft and something like a 747. With or >> >> >> > without >> >> >> > autopilot. >> >> >> > >> >> >> Basics are the same. >> >> > >> >> > So why is there a >> >> > >> >> > Multi Engine Rating ? >> >> > Instrument (instrument meterological conditions) Rating >> >> > (IMC) >> >> > Instrument (instrument flight rules) Rating (IFR) >> >> > Commercial Pilot's License >> >> > Air Tranport Pilot's Licence >> >> > Type Rating (on aircraft) >> >> > >> >> > And could you name the one single over-riding difference >> >> > between the use of >> >> > the rudder on any large passenger jet and your Cessna ? >> >> >> >> Seeing as Conor has failed to answer the question, Maybe >> >> you'd >> >> tell me. I know how a rudder is used on light aircraft. >> >> Tail >> >> dragger or tricycle especially during take-off or landing, >> >> but >> >> I can't see how it's use can be any different for large >> >> passenger jets. >> > >> > In a small private aircraft the rudder is used regularly in >> > turns for example to avoid wing drop. One of the first >> > lessons I >> learnt. >> >> That was down to your instructor. It's perfectly possible to >> make >> turns in a light aircraft without losing hight, just by use of >> the ailerons and elevator. > > Yeah but you'll lose energy. > > >> Using the rudder makes a turn more elegant, > > Damn right. > > >> as it can be used to keep the fuselage in line with the >> direction of flight. So it's desirable IMO but not necessary. > > Hmmmm. it's good practice anyway. Esp for PPLs. > > But I was so seemingly 'over-confident' at the flight I had > already > conducted already I was pushing it ! Interesting thing ... I > didn't > actually panic at all although I could see I was losing > altitude. Not enough elevator. The > instructor hadn't expected me to make such an aggressive turn > but being > a real pro - he let me get into trouble before pulling me out > and > explaining why. What starts off as a gentle turn can easily develop into a very sharp bank, turn and dive, unless the ailerons are used to keep the inside wing up, and the elevator is used to keep the nose up. > Then he let me fly over my home city before going the other > side and > pulling some 2G aerobatics. I gave up power flying after just a couple of lessons in a 172. I could see little fun in just flying around, so carrying on to get a PPL seemed pointless. But, had a go in a glider and was hooked. There's much more of a challenge to keeping a glider in the air, and being in close proximity to several gliders all doing tight turns in the same thermal can certainly get the adrenaline flowing. Was doing well and enjoying the lessons until business and tight financial circumstances meant I had to give it up. That was a few years ago. Maybe I'll go back to it, but somehow I don't think so. I still don't think I can really aford it. Mike.
From: Brimstone on 19 Jun 2008 04:30
Eeyore wrote: > Brimstone wrote: > >> If flying was more intellectualy challenging than driving a road >> vehicle then we wouldn't have computers controlling aircraft. > > No, that makes no sense at all. OK, I'll rephrase it. A computer (or other machine) hasn't yet been offered commercially that will steer a road vehicle (there have been some experiments) whereas such devices are used to control the direction, height and speed of an aircraft. Thus driving a road vehicle is a more complex task than flying a 'plane. > Let me remove the negatives and superfluity. You effectively said > > " If flying wasn't more challenging than driving a road vehicle > then we would have computers controlling aircraft. " No that's not what I said, see above. > And we DO have computers controlling major aspects of aircraft > operations. Right down to the automatic fuel control to maintain > engine speed / EPD via FADEC. So my point is made. > > The pilots are there to 'tell' the computers what to do (i.e to > actually fly the aircraft using the control interface like the > control wheel / sidestick, throttles etc and lets the computers do > the basic 'housekeeping' like ensuring all the temps and pressures > are correct and keeping a specific course if so demanded) and take > over if they break. > Indeed. |